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Coronavirus related conversation (1 Viewer)

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clark

Staff member
Chief Mentor
My doctor told me this morning that if you're over 80 and you contract this virus, regardless of the modern health care standards and modernity of your country, the odds are about 95% that it's going to kill you. It's that virulent and that 'efficient' at its work. Her advice to us older folks? Stay home. Period. And watch the news. Wash your hands with soap and water--never with the gel hand cleaner stuff you see everywhere. Phone your doctor about any other routine health issues, rather than visit the office. If you are in this elderly group and you permit your family dog or cat to lick your face (so cute!) . . .stop that!! The Bubonic Plague in Eurasia and Europe, 1347 - 1351, killed 100 million (yes, Virginia, that is million) people. So, esp. if you're elderly, take heightened precautions about hygiene and restrict contact with groups as much as possible. Just makes sense.
 

Phil Istine

Staff member
Global Moderator
My doctor told me this morning that if you're over 80 and you contract this virus, regardless of the modern health care standards and modernity of your country, the odds are about 95% that it's going to kill you.

Hi Clark. I'm wondering if there was a misunderstanding between yourself and your doctor. The figure I read the other day was 15 or possibly 20 per cent death rate for the over 80s with this infection. That's still not great but a hell of a lot better than 95%.

I saw that figure on the BBC website, and found similar on this one as well.
 

Foxee

Patron
Patron
And watch the news.
Wonderful idea if you want to be terrified and/or depressed all the time.
Wash your hands with soap and water--never with the gel hand cleaner stuff you see everywhere.
Why? I really dislike hand sanitizer but it has alcohol in it. If a coronavirus zombie sneaks up and licks me at the grocery store you will see me bust open the hand sanitizer station at the entrance and take a bath in the stuff. It's still better than nothing if that's what you've got at the moment.
 
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Irwin

Senior Member
It seems to me that if you wore any kind of face mask, you'd be better off than without, since air flow is going to take the path of least resistance, which would be around the mask rather than through it. Some might still get through, but most would go around.

And if you have the virus and wear a face mask, if you cough or sneeze, the air coming out of your mouth is going to be slowed down dramatically by the mask, even if it's just a dust mask.

Everyone in China's cities pretty much is wearing a face mask, and that could be why the spread of the virus is slowing. Those aren't N95 respirators; they're just cheap face masks.
 

SueC

Staff member
Senior Mentor
It seems to me that if you wore any kind of face mask, you'd be better off than without, since air flow is going to take the path of least resistance, which would be around the mask rather than through it. Some might still get through, but most would go around.

And if you have the virus and wear a face mask, if you cough or sneeze, the air coming out of your mouth is going to be slowed down dramatically by the mask, even if it's just a dust mask.

Everyone in China's cities pretty much is wearing a face mask, and that could be why the spread of the virus is slowing. Those aren't N95 respirators; they're just cheap face masks.

And they tell you to keep your hands away from your face, your mouth. The mask would certain help with that.
 

Biro

Senior Member
Wonderful idea if you want to be terrified and/or depressed all the time.

Why? I really dislike hand sanitizer but it has alcohol in it. If a coronavirus zombie sneaks up and licks me at the grocery store you will see me bust open the hand sanitizer station at the entrance and take a bath in the stuff. It's still better than nothing if that's what you've got at the moment.

Just to terrify or depress you even more. Shopping trolley's and baskets are disgusting. Anybody who coughs into their hand contaminates the trolley/basket. Then Foxee comes along picks same trolley and gets virused. Not to mention the slaves who stock the shelves. Then the badly paid checkout lady and the heavily infected card machine. Then back to the Trolley again which you push out to your shiney clean car and you accidentally transfer the plague to your door handles and steering wheel and controls. By the time you are home, a real infected virus Zombie you will be.

I was in supermarket last night and the checkout lady had no gloves and was handling cash, cards and loyalty cards from hundreds of shoppers.

On a serious point. I have seen a man picking his nose on the hot food counter and a woman at same licking her fingers to open the plastic bags to put the food in. She was actually serving me at the time and was really confused when I said forget it and walked away. Before this virus though.

My point is.......you just dont know.
 

KenTR

Senior Member
Joke for people in New York: The CDC announced that while face masks are ineffective at keeping you safe from the virus, scientists have discovered that you can achieve 100% protection by using plastic bags.

*waits for laughter to subside*

Thank you. I'm here all week.
 

Irwin

Senior Member
Joke for people in New York: The CDC announced that while face masks are ineffective at keeping you safe from the virus, scientists have discovered that you can achieve 100% protection by using plastic bags.

*waits for laughter to subside*

Thank you. I'm here all week.

They've also discovered that if you drink bleach, you'll be cured of the virus.
 

Theglasshouse

WF Veterans
Don't talk to people who are sick. Drops fall when you are talking invisibly even without sneezing or coughing. Avoid buses, cars, with people with the virus. Run and get away from them by avoiding them altogether. You can not be at an arm's length or in front of a person who has the virus and who is speaking with you. Covering your eyes with googles is helpful if you don't want the plastic suit to wear or the mask. Lots of people who have no signs or symptons of coughing or sneezing can infect a person just being in contact with them it was said by a doctor I overheard on a cellphone.
 

Phil Istine

Staff member
Global Moderator
My particular reality is that I have no savings and I was living hand-to-mouth anyway in a month-to-month struggle. As this escalates my income will likely plummet, that's if I'll even be allowed out after a particular point is reached. I'll likely be on close to nil income at some point. Mortgage and bills won't be paid. The vehicle lease won't be paid, so my means to earn a living will probably be taken away. The next time someone judges a guy on the streets, remember that not everyone is there due to self abuse.
I was in the process of selling my flat in order to become debt free or close to it ,and was looking forward to it in a bizarre way, but I can't see anyone buying now and I can foresee prices crashing anyway.
I'm fucked.
There will likely be a point where my internet access is from the local library - if it's open and if they let a smelly dosser from the streets in.
Getting killed by some virus doesn't feel too unattractive right now. That's not a hint at feeling suicidal, so don't misinterpret it please, but my life could be changing dramatically over the next few months.
 

luckyscars

WF Veterans
My doctor told me this morning that if you're over 80 and you contract this virus, regardless of the modern health care standards and modernity of your country, the odds are about 95% that it's going to kill you. It's that virulent and that 'efficient' at its work. Her advice to us older folks? Stay home. Period. And watch the news. Wash your hands with soap and water--never with the gel hand cleaner stuff you see everywhere. Phone your doctor about any other routine health issues, rather than visit the office. If you are in this elderly group and you permit your family dog or cat to lick your face (so cute!) . . .stop that!! The Bubonic Plague in Eurasia and Europe, 1347 - 1351, killed 100 million (yes, Virginia, that is million) people. So, esp. if you're elderly, take heightened precautions about hygiene and restrict contact with groups as much as possible. Just makes sense.

Your Doctor is on drugs, or you are.

It's not a 95% death rate for the eighty plus. It's 15%. Keep in mind most of that data is based on China, which is hardly a modern country in regard to healthcare access for most people.

Gel hand cleaner (sanitizer) isn't as good as proper use of soap and water, but it's a solid alternative when those are not conveniently available -- which is the only time most people use it. Saying 'never use hand sanitizer' makes no sense. Use it when out and about and wash your hands the rest of the time.

There is no evidence that dogs or cats can spread it. And certainly no evidence it would be from them licking your face. Although animals licking anyway is gross.

There are no useful numbers for how many people bubonic plague killed. Estimates range from 25 million to 200 million, most in the 50 million average. In any case, bubonic plague is a bacterial infection, so it's an entirely different thing to a virus, with very different infection rates, causes, treatments, etc. Worrying about a modern virus because of a Medieval disease doesn't make much sense IMO.
 
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luckyscars

WF Veterans
My particular reality is that I have no savings and I was living hand-to-mouth anyway in a month-to-month struggle. As this escalates my income will likely plummet, that's if I'll even be allowed out after a particular point is reached. I'll likely be on close to nil income at some point. Mortgage and bills won't be paid. The vehicle lease won't be paid, so my means to earn a living will probably be taken away. The next time someone judges a guy on the streets, remember that not everyone is there due to self abuse.
I was in the process of selling my flat in order to become debt free or close to it ,and was looking forward to it in a bizarre way, but I can't see anyone buying now and I can foresee prices crashing anyway.
I'm fucked.
There will likely be a point where my internet access is from the local library - if it's open and if they let a smelly dosser from the streets in.
Getting killed by some virus doesn't feel too unattractive right now. That's not a hint at feeling suicidal, so don't misinterpret it please, but my life could be changing dramatically over the next few months.

I'm so sorry to hear this, Phil.

My concern with coronavirus is 100% the economy, right now. That is, I think the virus itself is far less dangerous than humanity's reaction to it. The fact nobody is even talking about this stuff is crazy. There's no way closing down all the restaurants, stores, bars, hotels, whatever isn't going to have some terrible long term consequences. I'm not talking about the stock market (though for most American's that's a big deal) but the simple fact that many/most small businesses and self-employed individuals don't have the cash reserves to simply close up shop for two months. My father-in-law's business is 100% based on retailers making money to pay him and he's shitting bricks.

I'm tempted to say I'll pray for you, but if there is a god this is His fault. So, fuck the asshole.
 

Phil Istine

Staff member
Global Moderator
I'm so sorry to hear this, Phil.

My concern with coronavirus is 100% the economy, right now. That is, I think the virus itself is far less dangerous than humanity's reaction to it. The fact nobody is even talking about this stuff is crazy. There's no way closing down all the restaurants, stores, bars, hotels, whatever isn't going to have some terrible long term consequences. I'm not talking about the stock market (though for most American's that's a big deal) but the simple fact that many/most small businesses and self-employed individuals don't have the cash reserves to simply close up shop for two months. My father-in-law's business is 100% based on retailers making money to pay him and he's shitting bricks.

I'm tempted to say I'll pray for you, but if there is a god this is His fault. So, fuck the asshole.

As someone who had the grave misfortune to be raised a Jehovah's Witness and has been an atheist for many years, I don't believe in God - not even an arsehole of a God. However, I'm acutely aware that that my early conditioning can occasionally turn severe difficulties into an Armageddon syndrome.

The current reactions by many governments could easily trigger another Great Depression.

If I'm allowed out to work over the coming months, if I'm still earning enough I may have to resort to mortgage and essential bills only - bollocks to the debts.
 

Biro

Senior Member
Your Doctor is on drugs, or you are.

It's not a 95% death rate for the eighty plus. It's 15%. Keep in mind most of that data is based on China, which is hardly a modern country in regard to healthcare access for most people.

Gel hand cleaner (sanitizer) isn't as good as proper use of soap and water, but it's a solid alternative when those are not conveniently available -- which is the only time most people use it. Saying 'never use hand sanitizer' makes no sense. Use it when out and about and wash your hands the rest of the time.

There is no evidence that dogs or cats can spread it. And certainly no evidence it would be from them licking your face. Although animals licking anyway is gross.

There are no useful numbers for how many people bubonic plague killed. Estimates range from 25 million to 200 million, most in the 50 million average. In any case, bubonic plague is a bacterial infection, so it's an entirely different thing to a virus, with very different infection rates, causes, treatments, etc. Worrying about a modern virus because of a Medieval disease doesn't make much sense IMO.

All very true except for animals licking you. I have never caught anything from dogs. Whereas people have given me loads of ailments and definitely would never let another human lick my face or hands.

Most transmissions of disease from one person to another is by our own habits most of them disgusting.

When I was a kid we were told to wash our hands after using the toilet .....relentlessly. Before we eat or prepare food. Wash all food. Do not share clothes. Do not put things in your mouth because you do not know where it has been. We only ate our own prepared and cooked food. We used antiseptic soap and the smell of bleach was common.

There was good reason for all those things because people had learned from what had made them ill and killed them before. 'Cleanliness is next to Godliness' was one saying.

Everybody going around hugging and kissing each other because its the trendy thing to do in the past 10-20 years instead of just saying hello or at most shaking hands. (you can wash your hands).
 
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luckyscars

WF Veterans
All very true except for animals licking you. I have never caught anything from dogs. Whereas people have given me loads of ailments and definitely would never let another human lick my face or hands.

Then you're on the same drugs as Clark and his Doctor, Biro.

Human beings are by far the cleanest of any common mammal in terms of oral bacteria. Science shows dog saliva as being a common means of human transmission for E.Coli, Salmonella, and a bunch of other parasites due to their consumption of feces. Cats don't eat so much shit, but have their own parasites -- cat scratch fever is a famous example.

Nope, it's gross. Unless your dog or cat stays indoors all day, refrains from licking their bottoms and balls, and cleans their teeth more often than you, you probably shouldn't be getting busy with them.
 

Biro

Senior Member
As someone who had the grave misfortune to be raised a Jehovah's Witness and has been an atheist for many years, I don't believe in God - not even an arsehole of a God. However, I'm acutely aware that that my early conditioning can occasionally turn severe difficulties into an Armageddon syndrome.

The current reactions by many governments could easily trigger another Great Depression.

If I'm allowed out to work over the coming months, if I'm still earning enough I may have to resort to mortgage and essential bills only - bollocks to the debts.


Hang on in there Phil. You wont be the only one and they wont be letting people starve or sleep on the streets en-mass. (Wouldn't get them re-elected). If it gets that bad there will be some write off of the Ponzi banking scheme we live in. So it may actually help in away people like yourself of which there will be many.
 

Biro

Senior Member
Then you're on the same drugs as Clark and his Doctor, Biro.

Human beings are by far the cleanest of any common mammal in terms of oral bacteria. Science shows dog saliva as being a common means of human transmission for E.Coli, Salmonella, and a bunch of other parasites due to their consumption of feces. Cats don't eat so much shit, but have their own parasites -- cat scratch fever is a famous example.

Unless your dog or cat stays indoors all day and cleans their teeth more often than you, you probably shouldn't be getting busy with them.

Well I am really high LS. But you forgot to tell me what humans saliva and other bodily fluids contain? By the way a relation of mine caught worms from another human after eating a shop sandwich. So don't forget the parasites as well.

Over the years working on a farm, animals are treated for parasites regularly. They have to be otherwise they are no good. How often are people treated?
 

luckyscars

WF Veterans
But you forgot to tell me what humans saliva and other bodily fluids contain? By the way a relation of mine caught worms from another human after eating a shop sandwich. So don't forget the parasites as well.

Lots and lots, but also we are immune to a lot of them, either naturally or from vaccination. Also, most of us have good sanitation.

If your relation caught worms from eating a shop sandwich, it most likely was from what was in the sandwich or because the person did not wash their hands after touching their bum. Either way, I believe most people wash their hands more frequently than most dogs do. You may disagree.

Over the years working on a farm, animals are treated for parasites regularly. They have to be otherwise they are no good. How often are people treated?

Dogs and cats don't live on farms.
 

Biro

Senior Member
Then you're on the same drugs as Clark and his Doctor, Biro.

Human beings are by far the cleanest of any common mammal in terms of oral bacteria. Science shows dog saliva as being a common means of human transmission for E.Coli, Salmonella, and a bunch of other parasites due to their consumption of feces. Cats don't eat so much shit, but have their own parasites

Animals sometimes eat their own sh*te for a reason. Possibly their food is not up to standard.

But leaving dogs and cats alone. Have you any idea what the animals and fish we eat are infected with/carrying? But you still eat them.

Most fish are heavily infected with worms in their flesh. But you eat them and sometimes raw.

Meat is sometimes eaten raw or not properly cooked...(medium rare/rare cooked steak). You eat various parts of their flesh which could have parasites or even diseases.
 
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