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We weren't asked whether we wanted to join the EU, so when we were asked whether we wanted to leave we just set the record straight, that so far as we were concerned we never joined. The EU is a very different thing from the old Common Market.
Why what, sorry? Why talk about it? Why leave? You know, to me, the actual concept of leaving the EU is not without merit. If it costs money to stay in there, then there's a potential savings to at least be costed out. If we have some super whizz bang new innovations that the EU would stifle, then OK. The EU is far from flawless. But my issue is that none of this was put out there as the reason for leaving. I have no faith that the Leave movement have any of this as their incentives, preferring scare tactics and out-and-out fabrications before cashing in on the ensuing uncertainty. But really, none of this should have been put to a referendum. By and large people are simply not well-enough informed or sufficiently responsible (remember Boaty McBoatface?) to make a decision of this magnitude. Now we have a future driven by people that took in the rhetoric but who in far too many instances are not going to have to actually live through it, leaving that particular joy to the people that never wanted it (source). Rather cynically, it was only put as a referendum item so David Cameron could keep his job, which he bailed on when that backfired (he was a Remainer). I know of very few businesses that support it so I cannot see any economic benefit. The Queen should step in at this point or maybe we should divide the country down the middle and yes I'm totally going to write a story about that OMG plot bunnies plot bunnies!!!
@ Guard Dog. I can understand your reluctance to let history be revised to support a dodgy deal. I wish more people would keep pointing out that facts are not malleable.
Rob, who have you been talking to from the southern U.S.?
I was born and raised here, and I don't know anybody who'll claim there was no war, or that the south didn't lose.
Hell, Lee surrendered. That means somebody lost. Since Lee was a General... well, must'a been a war, 'cause it sure as hell wasn't a football game. :lol:
@ JustRob. I can see how the injustice of having your life arranged without consulting you is causing a level of frustration that requires some kind of action, I just don't understand why anyone would vote to wreck their own lives and the lives of countless others.
Hmmm.... I don't see this as a flook. A lot of media savvy big wheels used some very nasty emotional manipulation to force this result. This is a deliberate, long term, thoroughly cynical and successful form of warfare. None of the leave voters I know are going to change their minds despite the leave campaign being totally discredited. I suspect we are living through Brexit Mania, similar to the Tulip Mania which ended in 1637.OP JustRob. Our first past the post electoral system makes the average voter feel that their vote is unlikely to make any difference, the system being designed to maintain the stability of the major political parties. Hence we do not bother to consider the issues seriously. If we felt that knowing about them personally would make any difference then we might pay more attention to them, but in general our opinions have never had any effect on any issue in British politics and the referendum result was just a flook. The major political parties insist on our electoral system having this effect of potentially allowing government of the country to drift away from the wishes of the majority, so they should stick to their guns and never directly ask for our opinions on anything. They don't need a second referendum now but just the guts to ignore the results of the first.
However, the places that they found it difficult to find were the battle sites as many locals just denied that there'd been a civil war or such battles.
Better let Putin Know.