Coronavirus related conversation

[Irwin]

My particular reality is that I have no savings and I was living hand-to-mouth anyway in a month-to-month struggle. As this escalates my income will likely plummet, that's if I'll even be allowed out after a particular point is reached. I'll likely be on close to nil income at some point. Mortgage and bills won't be paid. The vehicle lease won't be paid, so my means to earn a living will probably be taken away. The next time someone judges a guy on the streets, remember that not everyone is there due to self abuse.
I was in the process of selling my flat in order to become debt free or close to it ,and was looking forward to it in a bizarre way, but I can't see anyone buying now and I can foresee prices crashing anyway.
I'm fucked.
There will likely be a point where my internet access is from the local library - if it's open and if they let a smelly dosser from the streets in.
Getting killed by some virus doesn't feel too unattractive right now. That's not a hint at feeling suicidal, so don't misinterpret it please, but my life could be changing dramatically over the next few months.

It seems likely that will be the case for a lot of people--especially those whose livelihood relies on tourism. Here in Colorado, the governor ordered all the ski resorts to close, which means all the workers involved are out of work. People aren't going to movie theaters or sporting events. People aren't eating at restaurants, so waiters and waitresses are adversely affected, as well as the business owners.

It is precisely this type of situation where an economic safety net is necessary, yet those at the top, here in the U.S. are actually trying to cut food stamps for those in need when this is a time when they're needed the most! Their "solution" is more tax cuts.

Good luck to you, Phil. I hope you manage to get through this okay.

[Foxee]

For Phil and anyone else in similar straits.

Living close to the financial razor's edge is a difficult place to be at the best of times and frightening in the worst of times. Don't give up or give in to fear. Don't be afraid or reluctant to take help when you really need it. I look back on some situations and am amazed that my family and I are still here.

Don't give up.

I also wanted to share this, Italians in lockdown, singing together from their windows

[bdcharles]

My particular reality is that I have no savings and I was living hand-to-mouth anyway in a month-to-month struggle. As this escalates my income will likely plummet, that's if I'll even be allowed out after a particular point is reached. I'll likely be on close to nil income at some point. Mortgage and bills won't be paid. The vehicle lease won't be paid, so my means to earn a living will probably be taken away. The next time someone judges a guy on the streets, remember that not everyone is there due to self abuse.
I was in the process of selling my flat in order to become debt free or close to it ,and was looking forward to it in a bizarre way, but I can't see anyone buying now and I can foresee prices crashing anyway.
I'm fucked.
There will likely be a point where my internet access is from the local library - if it's open and if they let a smelly dosser from the streets in.
Getting killed by some virus doesn't feel too unattractive right now. That's not a hint at feeling suicidal, so don't misinterpret it please, but my life could be changing dramatically over the next few months.

Set up a crowdfunding / patreon / gofundme type site. A friend of a friend set one up a couple of years ago - £100K, life-saving surgery - and we all tweeted it and whatnot with about 3 months to go, and it was tight but it exceeded the requested amount and the woman is still alive. Talk to your bank about waiving your mortgage as I heard some of them are doing that for the duration of any lockdown. Talk to whoever your lenders are - car, house - and see about an extension of time and a reduction of rates. If it comes to it, look into housing co-ops or just moving in with someone you know for a bit. We're not about to let you starve, man.

[luckyscars]

Talk to your bank about waiving your mortgage as I heard some of them are doing that for the duration of any lockdown. Talk to whoever your lenders are - car, house - and see about an extension of time and a reduction of rates.

As an American citizen & resident, hearing these suggestions made me retch with laughter.

[bdcharles]

As an American citizen & resident, hearing these suggestions made me retch with laughter.

I don't know how it is in the US but in the UK all this stuff - money lending - is a battle of wills at the end of the day, with two humans at the end of a transaction. Ultimately these people would rather get their money late than not at all, and without additional expense (and negative press) and if they know that you know that you have a handful of rights despite what they wish you to believe, they will capitulate to a point.

[Foxee]

As an American citizen & resident, hearing these suggestions made me retch with laughter.

Also as an American I would say that calling your lender and saying, "Okay, this is the situation" is way better than silence and non-payment. They want their money and they'll try to find ways to help you to defer things but if you say nothing you're likely to get exactly what cynicism says that you will.

[Amnesiac]

Interesting that in Germany and Italy, people in lockdown are buying and reading my stories. LOL

[luckyscars]

Also as an American I would say that calling your lender and saying, "Okay, this is the situation" is way better than silence and non-payment. They want their money and they'll try to find ways to help you to defer things but if you say nothing you're likely to get exactly what cynicism says that you will.

They won't try to 'help you', that's the wrong word. Lenders don't help, they mitigate risk. That's all they do, all they care about. I don't take 'Hail, Corporate!'

The probability of any major financial institutions in the US helping anybody in any real sense is zero. The only thing holding them back is future PR problems and the government. The U.S government has a long, esteemed track record of not giving a fig about the poor and are massively in these institutions pockets. It would have to be extremely bad for them to step in, and it isn't. Yet.

As far as the negative PR that comes with ruining people over things they can do nothing about? Well, if it's a small minority of people, there's no negative PR impact (proof of this: it's not like we give a shit about the millions who already lose their homes because they can't afford to pay) and if it's everybody, there's even less negative PR, because 'everybody is doing it'. If all the banks are doing the same thing (because they have to, to sustain their business model) there is no face to lose. Like when all the banks screwed the economy in '08. If they're all bad, they're all good.

But sure, I bet they'll put you on a payment plan. Won't be interest free, obviously. Banks don't 'want their money', they want you in debt. They love payment plans. They love deferring. The entire US financial system runs off bonded slavery. Hopefully for Phil's sake that's not the case in the UK, but I wouldn't bet on it.

[KenTR]

*While the banks, credit card companies and utilities may be forced to lighten up for now, once this is all over they will pounce on everybody with a vengeance because siphoning more than their fair share from our pockets is how they fill their swimming pools.

*I've been watching videos of people sticking their heads out of their windows and screaming at people on the streets to "go the fuk home!!!", to which the people on the street reply "Shut the fuk up!!!". Back and forth it goes, spittle flying everywhere. Our fumbling gov't officials and the goddamn alarmist media are only fueling panic. Too large a swath of the population are stupid assholes on a good day, and this whole situation is bringing out the worst in everyone. I'm sure there's plenty of good will to be found quarantined behind closed doors, but at the same time, some families and other cohabitants who generally hate each other are now forced to sit and stew together. Sooner or later, violence will begin begin to erupt. I've already been hearing more ambulance and police sirens than usual. It's really starting to look like a zombie apocalypse out there, and while I haven't spotted any of the undead, I did just see a giant COVID-19 virus thingee rolling down the street taking out everything in its path.

*Just watched a tortuous news segment about social distancing and the stress it will eventually cause. One suggestion was to keep in touch. They gave three suggestions: make calls, use Face Time, or write letters. Write letters? Since when did email become forbidden? I don't have a phone, so when people tell me to text them, I tell them I can't, but will email them. "Oh, I don't do emails.." is an all too frequent response. I never thought I'd see a situation where my reclusiveness would be an advantage. I've totally got this. I've been social distancing since 1989.

*Finally, no need to hoard toilet paper:

[Foxee]

Wow, now that was a parsing of my comments that really divorced meaning from context. I never said lenders or businesses are altruistic about 'helping', come on now.

However, realism is that when we enter into a business agreement, either on the selling (hey, writers, if you sell your work you'll be the business wanting the money) or the borrowing/using end it's contractual. It's not totally unreasonable to expect that the person running the business wants some kind of arrangement. That said if you're hard up about what gets paid, definitely paying to keep the lights on and the house or apartment in your name has to take precedence over your credit cards.

There seems to be a lot of cynicism about business. If you don't like people knocking down your door for the money, stop playing around with debt. There are other options.