Abstract - concrete - Page 3

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Thread: Abstract - concrete

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Theglasshouse View Post
    I will write a new poem. But need to learn the conventions. I am using videos so that I can get the material for free rather than books(and I am currently seeing something on rhyme which explains it well on youtube). To rhyme is something I want to do. So I will watch videos until I feel capable. Thanks for recommending me the imagery book and the explanations. I will eventually attempt something very simple. Maybe abab rhyme scheme. I haven't taken a poetry course and need a very big refresher and information on how to do it. I appreciated your explanations on imagery. Thank you.


    You need, but one convention, concerning concrete and abstract. And that is the use of: figurative language, figurative speech: connected to: The figurative devices ?

    The figurative devices as: Metaphor, simile, kenning, anaphora, ambiguity, antithesis, apostrophe, chiasmus, the conceit, irony, imagination, Metonymy, overstatement, understatement, oxymoron, paradox, parallelism, personification, The pun, symbol, superlative, even Zeugma's. The list is endless.

    Start asking yourself what are these things as devices, and what do they do to the poem's language.

    something quick about rhymes and rhythms.
    Rhythm means flow with accent or cadence — this moves both the context and the content within the poem.
    Now Rhymes

    Rhymes mean sound as music. Cling-clang
    What sustains the music in poetry. Where does music start in poetry?




    This means versification.
    This means the line is a unit has arrived to do these three things. The line or verse has been created by these 3 things.
    this unit can be made to be the same kind of unit in many very different ways to create different kinds of music.
    measuring lines. long and short with effect cadence and rhythm. measurement also mean counting lines for stanzas.

    Versification gives us:
    Stanza forms to hold rhyming patterns in the poems.
    Rhymes Can be both internal and end-line rhyme
    rhymes can also start the lines or fall on a certain accent or syllable in the line as well.
    so different kinds of rhyme schemes are invented.

    There is much to learn about what makes rhymes work in a poem. ("do they fit the poem's intent?") or do they pull away from the form/content as a unit.

    Read the poetry help pages on WF. Darren can connect you. Clark and I both have articles out there.

    a poet friend
    RH Peat

  2. #22
    I wrote a small poem. But need to make the images maybe more concrete, right now they are a bit abstract even though I am referring to a person. Asking darrren for an opinion.

    Thanks for the list of figurative devices. I did use a painting to depict the person. I am rather pleased since I used steam of consciousness. One of my oldest books in the house I live in is really a book on poetry and how to describe a painting. Then it suggests to write a poem.

    I like the list of rhyming also. I follow some rules I noticed of rhyme. Now to rewrite it.

    I won't attempt prosody such as something ambitious as a meter. First need to do the basics.

    You've both been helpful mentors. I will continue to read here on the website. If I have any questions I will contact darren as suggested before I try to workshop anything. It's one thing to defeat writer's block. It was difficult but I wrote my first poem in a good while. I noticed it has rhymes at the end of the line by accident.

    Thanks to the both of you who have displayed friendliness.
    Last edited by Theglasshouse; March 6th, 2020 at 03:54 PM.
    I would follow as in believe in the words of good moral leaders. Rather than the beliefs of oneself.
    The most difficult thing for a writer to comprehend is to experience silence, so speak up. (quoted from a member)

  3. #23
    The Glass house

    Creating new art from other artwork is called Ekphrasis. It's greek. They did that a lot. But it is far more than just description of the painting. But if entered into the thoughts of the person in the painting it's ekphrasis, an ekphrastic poem. If you expand the content of the other work it takes on it's own space as a unique piece of art.

    Basics would be trying to make the lines close to the same length. Don't count syllables or accents. just maintain a length of line. This will create an even cadence for the most part. It tends to have roughly the same number of accents in the line without counting. If you read a lot of metric poetry you might naturally fall into it when writing. I've done that. when I begin a poem I let it dictate its form to me. by the first 3-6 lines. A stanza might be discovered in that many lines. With rhymes you sometime begin with a rhyme scheme.

    Stanza forms and stanzas are another kind of rhythm in the poem that falls by the grouping of lines or the kind of lines that make the grouping.

    Just remember that meter means measurement. Anything measured in the poem becomes a rhythm. So versification is a rhythm of lines and breaths. each line has a breath pause at the end of the line. With a line that end-stops the pause become longer. Add a rhyme to that and the end of the line gets heavier yet. This is why I say learn to write through the rhymes into the next line. This will also tend to enjamb the lines. which pulls the line forward which good rhyming poetry should do. Otherwise every line ends in a thud-bump by end-stopping and rhyme with the line pause of the breath. This loses the melody in the rhymes. Because all the lines are going clunk on the end of every line.

    Watch out for adjectives and adverbs. Too many spoil the poem; they begin to distract and confuse the intent in the lines. The more direct in speech the better that lines and the more impact they'll carry. Only use an adjective/modifier if it helps the concept of the complete poem. Beginner tend to use far too many.

    a poet friend
    RH Peat

  4. #24
    Glass House, here is a fun exercise in writing poetry. I have used it many times when I felt “stuck” for what to write about. Listen to someone else’s conversation. Two people is enough but 4 or 5 is better. It’s best if these are talkative people with interesting things to say and ways of saying them. A pub or a party is a good place to start. It’s also interesting to listen to people for whom English is not their first language because they tend to structure their sentences in what sounds unusual to our ears or use idioms from their mother tongue in direct translation. If you don’t like crowded places or other people, try listening to the radio or a movie. Now just write down random phrases that strike you as interesting. Don’t actually listen to the conversation. Listen for phrases or arrangements of words that spark your attention. They don’t have to connect or make sense. After you have a page or two of phrases, start mixing them up and arranging them in ways that seem interesting to you. Look for context in the random alignment of words. Use as much poetic licence as you want. You don’t have to stick to the words on the page. Cut out whatever doesn’t seem to fit. Keep playing with it. Move things around. Add words or take them away. Play with line breaks and stanza breaks. Eventually, the words will start talking to you and telling you what’s they want. Now you’re writing poetry. You don’t always have to know what you are going to write about. It can be enough to play with words until meaning starts to reveal itself.

  5. #25
    Glasshouse -- the value of Tim's exercise lies in its initial randomness. As you fill up the page, however, your mind is going thru a subterranean selection process. YOU may not see, at the time, the parameters of that process, but obviously it is there, else why are you finding this phrase 'interesting' but that phrase, not at all. Stream-of-consciousness writing, on the other hand, attempts to 'record' the machinations and dissociative connections of a mind playing with itself around some sort of core awareness. Congruities may not be clear on initial reading, but some sort of 'thread' is invisibly holding everything together. It is 'there' from the beginning. Tim's exercise reverses that process.

    Either way, your mind and feelings are totally immersed in WORDS. You are not hopping across the log jam, or nervously running around the edges of it, you are totally WITHIN it, part of it.

    Keats writes in one of his Letters: "if the poem comes not as easily as the leaves to the tree, it had better not come at all." Keats, it must be noted, was a youth-genius who wrote poetry for six years and was dead at age 25. The writing model that he describes worked for HIM and generations of young poets have sat expectantly, pen poised, waiting for the moments of genius to arrive and breathe their way onto the page with the 'naturalness' he describes. We are not Keats. To break those 'frozen' periods we normal mortals have to endure, we need a working plan. Tim's exercise is such a working plan.



    "I believe in nothing but the holiness of the heart's affections and the Truth of the imagination". Keats, ​Letters

    "No man is an island entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main . . . any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind. And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls -- it tolls for thee. " John Donne, Meditation XVII

  6. #26
    Thank you all for your immense input. I saw this thread just now. I brought this up in a different thread but I think I can become more creative by observing everything around me. Of course rhpeat has stories given to me a lot of advice which I will use. I am in process of revision. I will record my observations that are pertinent to the poem and collect words and write until an idea is created. I still have a poem in process of revision and I will take all the advice in mind. Going to get a notebook handy for those moments to journal poetry. Right now I am away from my house. Thanks everyone.
    I would follow as in believe in the words of good moral leaders. Rather than the beliefs of oneself.
    The most difficult thing for a writer to comprehend is to experience silence, so speak up. (quoted from a member)

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