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  1. #1
    WF Veteran SilverMoon's Avatar
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    lovesick

    I see science in your eyes
    a formal climate
    of catastrophes
    stilled and silenced
    by sound of
    thought -
    shrill as
    red,
    if color
    could shout.

    Each time
    I look at you
    a pasteur rises-
    swift like silkworms
    green like sick chickens -
    a kind of cholera wall.

    but then

    I see love
    through a microscope
    dissect it like an insect
    til all that's left
    is the pulp of it,
    black
    like a leper’s toe
    fermenting in fret.

    I have a theory -

    there’s no cure for us.
    Last edited by SilverMoon; April 24th, 2019 at 12:03 AM.
    “The man who cannot visualize a horse galloping on a tomato is an idiot.”
    Andre Breton

  2. #2
    hello - a very original poem - real sickness as lovesickness?

    though, I can't make head or tail of the first verse.
    then we go into sickly metaphors, that are hard to make sense of, or even faintly chime with lovesickness, for me.

    sorry Silver, maybe it's just me, but I couldn't recognise anything here.

    till = til
    typo - than than
    Last edited by ned; April 18th, 2019 at 11:36 AM.
    grasp the mettle of things unsaid
    and strike the nail upon the head

  3. #3
    I see the poem distilled in the last verse. Interesting imagery - there are places where it could be tightened; like "a pasteur rises when I see you." However, cutting words and rearranging sentences would be just cosmetic I believe. Good job.
    "Self-righteousness never straddles the political fence."

    Midnightpoet


    "If it weren't for sin, what would we write about?"

    Midnightpoet


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  4. #4
    WF Veteran SilverMoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ned View Post
    hello - a very original poem - real sickness as lovesickness?

    though, I can't make head or tail of the first verse.
    then we go into sickly metaphors, that are hard to make sense of, or even faintly chime with lovesickness, for me.

    sorry Silver, maybe it's just me, but I couldn't recognise anything here.

    till = til
    typo - than than
    Hia, ned. Thank you for finding this poem to be an original one. It's not inteded to be easily deciphered, at least upon a first read. So, in your stating that you cannot make heads of tails of it, points not only to your honesty but to what I was counting on, an attempt to grasp the enigmatic. It's a "riddle poem", a kind of verbal puzzle describing something without actually naming it.

    It's also "pun poem" where one "play-on word" is the center word which has more than one or more meaning/or replacement of a word which cancels out the the doublel entandre.

    The key/central word here is "pasteur". This is not a misspell of "pasture". I am referring to Louis Pasteur, the French Chemist, Physicist, Biologist and one of the greatest saviors of humanity. He's best known for his "Germ Theory" - the causes and prevention of diseases.

    In S2, below, the imagery points to subjects of his cures - he came to the rescue of the silkworm with disease and invented innoculation for chicken cholera - also for rabies.

    This piece is not a riddle for sole riddle's sake. In this stanza, it explores a man's need to keep others at a distance. The pasture rises. It becomes a wall, a "cholera wall" which the man has created around himself. No one dare climb over it because it's diseased. "

    Each time
    I look at you
    a pasteur rises-
    swift like silkworms
    green like sick chickens -
    a kind of cholera wall.

    About your question as to first verse's meaning:

    I see science in your eyes
    a formal climate > He maintains strick control of self. The atmopshere of his personality
    of catastrophes

    stilled and silenced
    by sound of
    thought -
    >He's detached from emotion. He can only think in linear terms.
    shrill as
    red
    if color
    could shout
    > similie w/imagery to point up the above
    Ned, you ask
    real sickness as lovesickness?
    The title "lovesick" hints at these sickness I described. It's aslo a "play-on" word. Neither can the woman ever get close to anyone. She intellecualizes love. In this way, she also has built a wall around herself. The "microscope" is her wall.

    Pertaining, to the most joyous and rewarding of human bonds, the inability to love is a disease/sickness, as I see it. They are not even lovesick for love. Take the "Schizoid Personality", they can never love, just become fond of someone. So, yes a real sickness that cannot be cured, in this instance.

    till = til
    I'm taking your advice - "til" insead of "till". The latter is an older word. "til" is more informal and poetic.

    Thanks ned, for your review, questions and grammatical tips.

    Quote Originally Posted by midnightpoet View Post
    I see the poem distilled in the last verse. Interesting imagery - there are places where it could be tightened; like "a pasteur rises when I see you." However, cutting words and rearranging sentences would be just cosmetic I believe. Good job.
    Thanks, Tony! I did try to aim for a good job. My first "pun/riddle" poem and not without its challenges. I suppose after reading my reply to ned you might get why some of the imagery gets streched out a bit. It's not quite a narrative poem, where imagery does not play the largest role, but one which does has a story to be unraveled.
    Last edited by SilverMoon; April 19th, 2019 at 04:57 AM.
    “The man who cannot visualize a horse galloping on a tomato is an idiot.”
    Andre Breton

  5. #5
    Member Thomas Norman's Avatar
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    Laurie I read your poem yesterday and decided not to comment at once as I could see it was a deep one that needed careful consideration. I copied it and studied it last night when I had time to "get into it". Now this morning I see you have replied with explanations and I see I got it a bit wrong! However, I'll copy here what I concluded exactly as I wrote it.

    [This poem has deep meaning and needs careful analysis. In the first place I think the title and first line gives a clue to what follows. Science and Lovesick to me offer a way to bring the two together in a dance of death. Clearly the poem is aiming at various sicknesses; Pasteur discovered penicillin which revolutionized man's fight against disease. But was not a cure for lovesickness. The way the first stanza narrows down to 'red' the colour of blood and then that silent shout. Blood cannot speak but carries great potential, including disease. I get the feeling this first stanza has more to say that I'm unable to "get at". There's certainly a human in there somewhere; perhaps protesting?

    Stanza 2 is more straightforward showing the cures wrought by penicillin and the erection of a theoretic wall. Then that very important single line "but then" we turn to the lovesickness. Again the stanza narrows to the colour, but this time it's "black" and we know that love has no chance. It's there, a sickness with no cure as told in the final couplet. We are indeed worse off than germs! ]

    That's what I thought last night, now having read your comment above I see how shallow my reading was and I entirely missed many of the poem's deeper meaning. Well I knew it was deep but much more so than I thought.
    A wonderful poem and I shall now study it with greater insight. This is what experimental poetry is all about! T.

  6. #6
    hello Silver - thank you for your considered response.

    yes, I'm aware of Louis Pasteur thank you (I did go to school) and understood 'pasteur' loosely fitted into the wider poem.
    I drink pasteurised milk every day.

    but I wasn't asking for an explanation - and if a lengthy one is required, then perhaps the poem comes up short.

    yes, poetry can sometimes be enigmatic - but purposefully puzzling doesn't do it for me, as a reader.
    lacking the rewards for my time with poetic meaning, insight and resolution.

    perhaps in future, you should label such poetry, to warn those readers who don't want to play the game..

    for me, it is frustrating that you obviously have the poetical technique and the germ of an idea (yes, pun intended)
    yet choose to express it in an unfathomable way - does it come easier to you in this fashion?
    grasp the mettle of things unsaid
    and strike the nail upon the head

  7. #7
    WF Veteran SilverMoon's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Thomas Norman Laurie I read your poem yesterday and decided not to comment at once as I could see it was a deep one that needed careful consideration. I copied it and studied it last night when I had time to "get into it". Now this morning I see you have replied with explanations and I see I got it a bit wrong! However, I'll copy here what I concluded exactly as I wrote it.

    [This poem has deep meaning and needs careful analysis. In the first place I think the title and first line gives a clue to what follows. Science and Lovesick to me offer a way to bring the two together in a dance of death. Clearly the poem is aiming at various sicknesses; Pasteur discovered penicillin which revolutionized man's fight against disease. But was not a cure for lovesickness. The way the first stanza narrows down to 'red' the colour of blood and then that silent shout. Blood cannot speak but carries great potential, including disease. I get the feeling this first stanza has more to say that I'm unable to "get at". There's certainly a human in there somewhere; perhaps protesting?

    Stanza 2 is more straightforward showing the cures wrought by penicillin and the erection of a theoretic wall. Then that very important single line "but then" we turn to the lovesickness. Again the stanza narrows to the colour, but this time it's "black" and we know that love has no chance. It's there, a sickness with no cure as told in the final couplet. We are indeed worse off than germs! ]

    That's what I thought last night, now having read your comment above I see how shallow my reading was and I entirely missed many of the poem's deeper meaning. Well I knew it was deep but much more so than I thought. A wonderful poem and I shall now study it with greater insight. This is what experimental poetry is all about! T.
    Thomas, thank you so much for giving my poem such degree of thought/study. This comming from a seasoned poet and one of great stature which I concluded after reading just one of your poems means more to me than you could know. It would also mean as much to me comming from a poet who is also curious without such background. Curiosity doesn't kill the cat. It's a gift meant to enliven the intellect.

    There's no right or wrong when writing outside classical structure. Your very keen analysis/take on my poem caused me to re-read it several times. Your notions of what the two colors represent: "Red" as being blood and "Black" as having no chance for love - run deeper than my intent, in fact. Simply, a brilliant interpretation. You've enriched my mind and perhaps, your metaphors, re-constructed, will find themselves in poem to come.
    I get the feeling this first stanza has more to say that I'm unable to "get at". There's certainly a human in there somewhere; perhaps protesting?
    I will be re-visiting this stanza. I think a seque might be required. Thanks!

    This experimental poem, the "puzzle/pun", was not easy to come by but rewarding throughout the entire write, not just in the final outcome. Venturing without a very firm and certain intent is nothing new to me and surely other writers experience this kind of ride - writing by the headlights.

    For this review, I thank you. It's this kind of give and take which makes for a classroom. This is what I think the boards should be all about. With this being said, I am now all the better of a student for it. Much thanks, Laurie
    “The man who cannot visualize a horse galloping on a tomato is an idiot.”
    Andre Breton

  8. #8
    WF Veteran SilverMoon's Avatar
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    Hi ned, thank you for your reply. Given that your points are singularly direct it will be easier for me to quote you then respond.

    sorry Silver, maybe it's just me, but I couldn't recognise anything here.
    Given that nothing about the poem resonated with you, I felt it was my responsibility as author/fellow poet to explain.

    but I wasn't asking for an explanation -
    Per you statement above, why would you not want one?

    and if a lengthy one is required, then perhaps the poem comes up short.
    If a reply is lengthly, I see it as an act of generosity having nothing to do with the poem's merrit.

    yes, I'm aware of Louis Pasteur thank you (I did go to school) and understood 'pasteur' loosely fitted into the wider poem.
    That you saw "pasteur" was a good fit is pleasing. Whether or not you went to school is no matter of importance. There are plenty of "educated fools" out there.

    I drink pasteurised milk every day.
    It's fortunate that you're blessed with such convenience. I live on a farm and have to milk my own cow everyday (a polite winky)

    yes, poetry can sometimes be enigmatic - but purposefully puzzling doesn't do it for me, as a reader.
    ned, if it ain't yo thang, sometimes it jus be dat way. Everyone has a perogative to like or dislike a poem. A puzzle is always created with purpose. Think board game puzzles.

    for me, it is frustrating that you obviously have the poetical technique and the germ of an idea (yes, pun intended)
    yet choose to express it in an unfathomable way - does it come easier to you in this fashion?
    Not one of my poems comes easy by me. If they were to, I might as well keep them to my own personal journal. And I like your pun!

    perhaps in future, you should label such poetry, to warn those readers who don't want to play the game..

    Sorry, no way Jose'! The only "warning" I'll preface to a poem is "LANGUAGE USED", a ruling for Poetry implemented by Staff.


    Yeah! And good for us. We've just hashed this out in a civil and direct way. No kidding....I might do my own spin on "Mary had a Little Lamb" And might use LANGUAGE to spice it up!

    Thanks again, ned.



    “The man who cannot visualize a horse galloping on a tomato is an idiot.”
    Andre Breton

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by SilverMoon View Post
    I see science in your eyes
    a formal climate
    of catastrophes
    stilled and silenced
    by sound of
    thought -
    shrill as
    red,
    if color
    could shout.

    Each time
    I look at you
    a pasteur rises-
    swift like silkworms
    green like sick chickens -
    a kind of cholera wall.

    but then

    I see love
    through a microscope
    dissect it like an insect
    til all that's left
    is the pulp of it,
    black
    like a leper’s toe
    fermenting in fret.

    I have a theory -

    there’s no cure for us.
    we're worse off than germs.

    OOOO Gawd! Laurie, you know I am a fan of your fantastically twisted mind... I have one too Now... the imagery is fabulous and your poetic language is second to none... but.... here's the thing... people read poetry for many personal reasons and I know you know that. I read poetry hoping to gain insight into MY OWN twisted mind... hoping to learn something new about myself, or to be shown a tired emotion in a new and exciting way... while your poem has some of those elements, I found this poem chaotic...and I felt like I was not smart enough to unravel the mystery... Did I like it? Yes I did.... Can I relate to the emotions? I cannot, because I don't completely grasp the message... Thank you for sharing....
    She lost herself in the trees,
    among the ever-changing leaves.
    She wept beneath the wild sky
    as stars told stories of ancient times.
    The flowers grew toward her light,
    the river called her name at night.
    She could not live an ordinary life,
    with the mysteries of the universe
    hidden in her eyes....
    Author: Christy Ann Martine

    Death leaves a heartache no one can heal,
    love leaves a memory no one can steal....
    Author unknown.

  10. #10
    WF Veteran SilverMoon's Avatar
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    Juls, I have been wondering where you've been! I've been abscessed for sometime as well, too. lol

    We've known each other for a long time and can easily say that it has been you who had consistantly cheered me on from the start, providing me with confidence which allowed me to bring that extra push you over the cliff Confessional writes.

    Trust, I'm not done with them. Even after all this time, there's so much territory to cover. The map of me is somewhat world-wide, as I know yours is.

    I'm really glad you took to the imagery, some of which is pretty gross. I think this is just one testament to us meeting up on firm ground, shaking hands and saying "OOO Gawd, I'm so glad you're my "twisted sister" (isn't that a band?!)

    The thing is. There is nothing emotional about this poem because the two persons are entirely void of them. Only in this, did "I" find sadness.

    The poem is up for interpretaion. Like I said to Thomas, who went his own brilliant way with it, there's no right or wrong here.

    And if the language is just simply appreciated, I'm glad for that and thank you. I've read plenty of poems beyond my reach yet fell in love with the lanuage. Then I just "Let the Mystery Be" (an Iris Dement song) - took what I needed from them and that was all.

    And I'm not all that smart. Since I never wrote a thesis about "The Germ Theory", I had some boning up to. The search bar has never been a stranger to me. I just liked to be armed with exactness in order to abstract it, if this makes any sense? My Confessionals have at times required research.

    Thanks. And again, I've missed you and your flair for words! Both in your poetry and reviews....




    “The man who cannot visualize a horse galloping on a tomato is an idiot.”
    Andre Breton

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