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When is enough, enough?

Discipline is not a common commodity. I have often wondered why some people, a small majority, seem to be able to obtain wealth while others seem to work but never really get ahead.

Making money is a lot like writing, it takes tons of practice, lots of failures before you ever really get a real understanding of how the process works.

Just as any author that starts the next book after having a best seller, the businessman is no different. One good deal does not mean you quit or back off, but move on to the next challange. There are simple basic rules to business just as there is to writing. Just as there are places like the WF for writing, there are lots of resources for those who wish to learn about business and accumulating wealth.

It does take almost the same effort to write a bad book or story as it does a good one. The difference is in the details and the talent of the writer. Some of it may come naturally, most of it comes from hard work.

So when is enough, enough? I often hear people comment how they are happy to have what they have. No desire to earn more, make to the top, or even worse somehow feel that financial success is somehow and evil thing. We expect good writers and storytellers to keep telling stories, that is after all what they do.

This is where discipline comes in, something I have been struggling with the last few months with a new partner. I have multiple businesses and multiple partnerships in other businesses. I am a silent partner in those. I offer financing and business advice. There are a few times when I am a hard nose hard ass, when it comes to how things are done, but very rarely. I am for the most part a cheerleader, "You can do it. Good job. This is how you might want to do this or that." Teaching someone the art of making money is what I try to do.

I am very selective in who I invest my time and money in. I work with what I consider hard working moral men who I can trust, as I still do business on a handshake.

This is the part that has me stumped. Say you were making a $1000 a week. I take you on as a partner, you will have an investment and stake in what we do. You will work longer hours than you did in the past and you will be exposed to risk. So lets just say as an average instead of making that $1000 a week now you are making $3500 a week, do you cut back your hours just because it is more money than you are used to?

All businesses succeed when they take care of customers needs, and solve a problems for them. The people you are responsible for, the more people that depend on you the more successful you will be.

When I take on a new partner it is because I have created a new market or customer that needs what we make, those customers depend on us.

This is the part that I have been struggling with, I need my partners and my companies to be able to take care of those people. It has nothing to do with did you make enough money to keep you happy. Most of my partners in order for me to take care of business, need to make more than just a good wage. For me to make money off them, they need to be at the top of the game not treading water.

I am up front with those that I deal with, I explain to them that I can make them a millionaire and that in the process they are going to make me a lot of money as well. I let them know that when they are successful that I am successful. I ask them, will they begrudge me making money off them if I make the rich. I have never had anyone tell me no in the beginning.

What I am struggling with is someone who is happy to make more money than they did before, but as soon as they get to the point where they have more than they need, to keep working and not call it a day or week.

While most here will not be able to identify with monetary aspect of this problem. All most all of you at some point decided that even though you just wrote a great story, had it published or won a writing contest, you did not stop writing nor slow down.

I work and make deals long after I need to, just as some of you will always write.

Is this a trait we are born with or can it be learned? Maybe it is strength maybe it is a weakness. I would be interested in hearing your thoughts about what motivates someone to keep going, through sucesses or failure.


Could part of it be fear? As in, this person realizes how much they're already making and they can't find a need to make even more for themselves. They also know that as the stakes get higher, the more they stand to lose, and so they'd rather not find themselves in a position where they wished they'd taken the $750,000 rather than have gone for the million dollar question and lost it all (metaphorically speaking). Maybe they have a family and are worried about not having enough time to spend with them?

The only thing I can think of might be to tell them that it's less about the money, and more about the greater amount of people that the business can reach and help / provide good service to.

I know this is a little off-topic, and also that his video is fairly long and you probably don't have all the time in the world, but I was wondering what you thought about this Bob.

Take care!
Thanks for the share :}

Money is a tool, kind of like the mechanic that has only a few hand tools verses the guy who has all the speciality tools and diagnostic equipment. The problems never look as tough or as overwhelming when you have what it needs to get the job done.
First para... The first two statements are barely... connected (?) I see 'hard worker, rare' and 'lack of ability regarding advanced money-making'. I guess that's the disconnect for me, the jump between the two.

Im going to assume that you pick hard workers to back. Isn't that the same as a disciplined worker? I mean that you have to be self- discipline to work hard, don't you? Anyway, interesting subject.
I always associated big wealth with intelligence but some of the big football clubs pay mediocre managers massive salaries and often sack them soon as for them to have other big clubs asking them to join there clubs..not because their successful but mediocre at their job..
escorial;bt13449 said:
I always associated big wealth with intelligence but some of the big football clubs pay mediocre managers massive salaries and often sack them soon as for them to have other big clubs asking them to join there clubs..not because their successful but mediocre at their job..
Kevin you get my dilemma then. It is one thing to have someone work 'with' me and work real hard, put in the long hours and go the extra mile. It is very different when it comes to them being by themselves and they are the ones that determine how long they are going to work.

I am a passionate guy that is born into the roll of cheerleader and can get most guys to go the extra mile, hustle, turn up the pace and really shine. I get discouraged when without my presences that same hustle that same desire to push hard is not there. That is the discipline I am talking about.

They see what it takes, they watch the old guy 'me' run every where and hustle at everything I do. I don't stand around, take breaks or chit chat when I work. I would have expected at some point for them to understand that this is what it takes to get to the top.

Self discipline along with your character, are always determined by the choices you make when you think, no one is looking.

That is the balance I am trying to understand.

Escorial, wealth is a combination of intelligence, hardwork and your comfort level when it comes to taking risks.

You have to be smart enough to see an opportunity, be willing to risk your personal money and time in that opportunity and be willing to work a lot more hours and devote tons of time and energy to make it happen. You have to be able to suffer the set backs and still smile. Be able to learn from your mistakes without getting discouraged. You need to be able to put others first. Your customer, your employees all come ahead of your interests.

Big wealth is the ability to be responsible for the livelihoods of a lot of families and having a product or service that someone is willing to spend their hard earned money on. That is where big wealth is generated from.
For me, it would be all about financial security and yes, of course, not wanting to risk failure if I could quit when I was ahead of the game. Well, not quit exactly. I suppose if I'd done well in something I'd retain an interest but as for pushing and hustling for money,status,position, success etc. Why? I don't get that. I can see how success might be a way of life, an addiction almost, for the lucky few, and I wouldn't begrudge helping and advising others.
Enough, for me though, would be, a comfortable life and not having to count the pennies.
Dear Plasticweld,
In my opunion, there are different types
of hard/disciplined workers. Some work
out of responsibility to the job itself or
for recognition from the boss and some
are out for the money.
Those motivated by acceptance and
validation may have the drive you hope
for but you’ll have to be a round the
clock boss.
Background may have an influence. If
they’re making more money than ever,
more than their parents could imagine,
this new wealth and security is not to be
risked. Remember they’re new at this,
you might be their dream come true but
outside opinions like family may determine
their actions.

Your drive to succeed is rewarded with
money and the opportunities, luxuries,
freedom that come with it.
The thing inside you that pushes you,
as I see it...is a type of logic. Inherent?
Not sure, but you feel it, you understand

Others, such as myself, are not motivated
by money, damn sometimes I wish I was,
having what I need is all I need. I enjoy a
good raise for cost of living and perhaps a
bonus for work well done but persuing the
deal has never interested me.

Writing however, is different. Like you and
deal making it’s a force. It stands alone.
Can’t explain it since it’s still kind of new
and I’m still discovering new phases. Yes,
I have many unfinished poems, started and
not yet completed trying to excerpt
disapline, in search of the g spots rhythmic
poetic flow. And frustrated sometimes
because it refuses to be forced.

One other aspect of non-motivation could
be the generations work ethic. Not an
excuse, just maybe the way they were raised.

So... with all that being said, hopefully a
little insight shed, happy Saturday.
Just thought of something else...
maybe when they reach a certain
point, it’s overwhelming. Going forward
equals the unknown for them.
You’ve been here before and see ten
miles up the road, maybe
it’s a matter of trust. That....you may
or may never get. All the best to you.
Tuesday, I see you get the comparison between writing and business. I consider myself very fortunate to be a passionate person about both. I tend to get excited and enthusiastic about a lot of things. I know just what it is like to have a story in my head. To go over the plot lines, over the dialog and spin all those things together in my head. I know first hand that excitement about telling the story and getting the reader to smile or reminisce or to let him or her into secret world. Those things are what make writing truly special.

I know what it is like to create a business from an idea. The excitement and planning and all the thought that goes into new ideas and strategies. I have had 14 businesses since I was 18 and loved the challenge of learning something new.

Writing for me as become part of who I am, it has never been easy. I was a D student in school and needed extra help to just pass English. While I still need lots of improvement, it has been a blast to learn from the others here. I have picked up on the other members passion, been encouraged by their work and their effort, which set the bar high for me and my desire to improve. Reading well crafted stories here did much to inspire me. Realizing the long hours and countless failures of some of the writers here that I admire most, did much to show me that they also had to work diligently as well.

What I consider good, what I consider acceptable is far higher now than it was before joining this forum. I don't see writers here who just want to write enough to get by or just enough to get published...they want to be good. They want to be at the top of field not somewhere in the middle.

For many writing is an escape, a hobby something they do with their spare time and energy. It is their passion and part of who they are. But, more than likely if they never wrote again, they would still put food on the table, still have a roof over their head and life would go on.

We all work for a living, we all have to go to work. While we can chose somethings there are others tasks we must just shoulder as adults. What we do for money is one of them.

Maybe it is my lack of understanding of what drives us to be passionate about some things in life while being causal about others. I will continue to get excited about some of the mundane things in life. A silly grin plastered on my face smiling at an inside joke that runs through my head, that only I seem to get. I will continue to wonder why some are missing that smile and the experience. Thanks for such a thoughtful reply...Bob
I think we have hidden programs running in our heads. When a situation occurs the program gets activated. Your person earning a certain amount has perhaps reached a certain 'program expectation maximum'.

I get that. I think there are many that reach a certain level of wealth and 'feel' like it is enough. In some cases their assessment may be pre-mature as things can and do change in regards to income and costs of living. A thing that works today ( business ) may not work tomorrow, and/or they may work today but their body( mind) may quit on them.

I do know several people that worked, made a bunch of money, retired young, and have no regrets. Some of them dabble in business ventures, or work in a consulting capacity for their former businesses, but not out of necessity; they've got plenty and are able to do pretty much whatever they want. The business part of their life was not a joy for them, it was means to end which they reached. I guess you could say they had enough. One thing they did have in common was being in a partnership or sole ownership position.

Yes, they were disciplined, hard workers but there was also some luck involved. The thing they did then could not be done now, not in the same way they did it. Of course there are other ways.
I do know ( or did: one of them passed) two people that their work was what they enjoyed doing. They had millions, could retire and never spend it all, whenever, if they had so chosen.
i know because I asked.

The one said he didn't want to travel, had no other hobbies. He worked up until the day his cancer got so bad he couldn't anymore, and then he died in his late eighties.

The other continues to work to this day, loves going to auctions to try to get good (but relatively tiny) deals, and always appears enthusiastic about business ( material house/ construction supply). I think that is his hobby. He has says there is nothing that he would rather do than what he does everyday, which is all business. There's no golf, no motorcycles, fancy cars, trips- he just likes making money. He does like going to his boxing shows that he is the promotor of, and getting in the ring to present awards or stand there and be photographed with all the 'players' ( fighters, announcers, management).

You're right about money being a tool as he has been able to succeed in a lot of different ventures, providing services or products in the industry some of which are the best ( I could go into detail).
Thanks for sharing Kevin, you hit on many truths concerning what motivates people. I have found a few things that wealthy people tend to share as a common trait. The concept that money is just a way of keeping track of how well they are doing in the game. In one respect money means almost nothing, in another pennies count because they realize how they add up. The other Common thing is their shyness to ever share how they are doing. I have one friend who purchased his second airplane. When I ask how many people he had told he said just you and one other friend. He knew that only a handful of others would congratulate him on his purchase rather than throw it up in his face how lucky he was too be able to afford two planes. He is a guy that has multiple busineeses work a lot of hours takes risks and is always hustling something. He also loves what he does. Of the friends that I have I can not picture any of the any of them ever retiring.

I always joke with my friends that I have all my retirement plans all laid out and that I am going to stick to them no matter what. When I turn 72 I plan on taking Fridays off. I still like what I do, have a couple of expensive hobbies and also realize that if I waited until I retired that I would be too old to race motorcycles or cars or go snowmobile riding in the mountains. Somehow the balance of work and play means the play is worth that much more and it also let me look forward to going to work. I realize I am one of the few in life who look forward to going to work on a Monday and enjoy what I do. Thanks for both of your thoughtful replies...Bob
To be honest, having given this some thought, and in the context that PW is discussing, I would say that enough is enough when you've HAD..... enough. Does that make sense?
Discipline is not a common commodity. I have often wondered why some people, a small majority, seem to be able to obtain wealth while others seem to work but never really get ahead.

We're dealing with value-laden concepts here: Wealth and "getting ahead".

By global standards, every American is obscenely wealthy. Where one chooses to rest along that continuum of wealth is a personal choice. If you see potential in someone that that person chooses not to use, you can assume that they are "lazy". But you are likely to be wrong. Our potential, our energy is the only thing that we as humans truly control. The fact that someone may or may not wish to sell their work / talent / abilities is a deeply personal choice. The individual does not owe society anything other than what is voluntarily agreed to in The Social Contract. You have the freedom to only hire those that wish to tap their full potential, and as a business owner I understand you doing that. But, IMHO, there is nothing wrong with that group of folks that fall outside your parameters.
Some lead, some follow. Your arm will get tired before you get that flogged horse to move.

"Getting ahead" is a concept so nebulous it's almost nonsensical. Ahead of who? To where?
Competition is great. As individuals, we should always drive towards personal improvement. But often, there is no financial reward to such improvement. Quite the contrary, look a the Doctors Without Borders. These folks miss out on years of top medical pay for the "honor" of working in malaria, dysentery infested dirt holes. But, compare them to rich, successful doctors that bilk Medicare out of billions every year. Which ones really "got ahead"?

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