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John 3
June 17th, 2017, 09:33 PM
First I must apologise for posting this on the forum but I had no choice because I was told if I posted on the appropriate forum it would be pulled; so much for the freedom of voicing opposite opinions.

The poem in question was on the globalization of religious beliefs; every one of the differing religions would be harnessed in the worship of one god. Hardly an original theme but no matter. The poem centred on the two main religions Christianity and Islam with Jesus and Mohamed looking at each other with adoring eyes and the two religions would unite as one. Hmm, I don’t know what odds a bookmaker would give on that happening but at a guess I think starting around 10.000 to one.
However it’s a poem not a forecast so I replied by saying apart from a contrived rhyme it was an Ok piece. This didn’t satisfy the author who proceeded to give me a lecture on good manners. Then the seventh cavalry arrived to sooth his feelings with comments that another Welsh poet would have been proud of. Sorry friend you’re no Dylan Thomas who wouldn’t have wrote a poem seeking to unite two religions with this opening line even when he was legless.


Quote ‘I painted a picture of Mohammad’

Congratulations, this single line completely nullifies the meaning every following line. You have just succeeded in grossly insulting the entire followers of the Koran; many have paid with their lives for far less.

By the way I am not a Muslim.

EmmaSohan
June 18th, 2017, 12:29 AM
A forum works a lot better when it is moderated. The moderators work for free in a mostly thankless job. If they decide we shouldn't do something, we most often should just shrug and move on. It wasn't important; people see things differently; etc.

You write well, with power. So you need to be more careful than others when you criticize.

(One website said that images were okay as long as they weren't worshipped. True?)

Jay Greenstein
June 18th, 2017, 04:46 AM
I'm confused, given that this isn't in the poetry forum, and your problem is poetry related, why post here?

But that aside, as I see it, you rendered a judgment on the poem's message, and the author didn't like your comment. So what? And that others defended the author's viewpoint? So what? You gave your view and they disagreed. But it's not a win/lose thing. If you comment on someone's work and they take it badly stop commenting on their work. It's that simple.

Surely you're not seeking to argue over the comments on the comments? That's how flame wars begin and this is not the place for that sort of thing.

But that aside, don't waste your time arguing religion. All religions are based on magical events, and require the follower to believe in spite of any and all evidence to the contrary. You believe in the doctrine because you choose to. So approaching such a belief system with logic when they are arguing emotion is like trying to teach a pig to sing. According to Robert Heinlein: "Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes time and annoys the pig."

Phil Istine
June 18th, 2017, 07:17 AM
The poem in question was on the globalization of religious beliefs; every one of the differing religions would be harnessed in the worship of one god. Hardly an original theme but no matter. The poem centred on the two main religions Christianity and Islam with Jesus and Mohamed looking at each other with adoring eyes and the two religions would unite as one. Hmm, I don’t know what odds a bookmaker would give on that happening but at a guess I think starting around 10.000 to one.
However it’s a poem not a forecast so I replied by saying apart from a contrived rhyme it was an Ok piece. This didn’t satisfy the author who proceeded to give me a lecture on good manners.

You have misrepresented the comment about manners. You were not accused of bad manners for your critique on the poem, rather, it was about you digressing away from commenting on the poem and inserting some of your own views about the issues raised. There is a very good reason why this is discouraged - the main one being that debating is against the forum rules.
If you had stuck to discussing the poetry rather than the sentiments of the content, I don't think there would have been an issue.
It's even OK to say that you think a poem is of low quality, but be prepared to say why without discussing the merits of the content.

mrmustard615
June 18th, 2017, 09:34 AM
This thread has been moved to the lounge. as it has no place in Writing Discussion. I also must remind everyone that WF has a no debate policy. If you want to have a debate, go to Facebook.


Thank you.


EDIT: Since moved to Poetry Discussion

Chesters Daughter
June 18th, 2017, 05:18 PM
I'm afraid there seems to be a bit of confusion regarding what transpired with the "poem in question". I did not deny you freedom of speech nor did I dissuade you from voicing your opinion in any manner. I also did not tell you if you posted your opinion ON THE WORK ITSELF that I would pull it.

This issue is not about your feelings about the poem, it's about going off topic in a creative thread. You posted your honest critique and was thanked by the OP. You then came back into the thread and went off topic by posting a little story based upon your personal experience which did not address the poem in the least. When the OP politely pointed out that doing so was improper manners, you assumed he was somehow retaliating against you because you had issues with his work, and passed a less than polite comment. When I went in to explain that going off topic was indeed poor manners, you came back into the thread again went off topic to label the posters with positive reviews a fan club, pass a few more impolite comments and complain that the poem in question was receiving so much attention while other threads received too little. So I again went into the thread to explain why the posts were off topic and told you you could discuss your issues regarding the lack of responses either with me via PM or start a discussion regarding same in Poetry Discussion for which I provided a link. I then went on to warn that the next off topic post would be pulled NO MATTER WHO POSTED IT.

I hope this clarifies things in a better fashion. Never would I silence a member's voice when it comes to proper critique and implying I did exactly that made me seem quite the despot which could not be further from the truth.

aj47
June 21st, 2017, 02:34 AM
I have a few questions for John 3 (with the understanding that I've not read the poem): How can you say describing an act, even a blasphemous or heinous act, "nullifies" anything for anyone other than yourself? Are you somehow anointed? Is this then the new cultural appropriation? Stealing someone's outrage?

brianpatrick
June 21st, 2017, 05:22 AM
https://youtu.be/F_1EiVAb_O8


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

mrmustard615
June 21st, 2017, 09:54 AM
The thread is closed. I don't think we need to rehash the subject again.