Thread: The Mary Sue Test

I'm not sure if anyone has actually made a post about Mary or Gary Sues as of yet. So, if this thread is repetitive please delete it.

But here's my quick two cents. I can't stand Mary and Gary Sues in books, movies, comics, and TV series. They lack any depth or character development. They lack any actual flaws that make them even human, and they are extremely annoying, either too helpless or too super powerful. They just make me want to cringe and rip out my eyes. The most popular Mary Sue would have to be Bella from Twilight. Let me end it right there before I get any hate mail from all you haters. I'm just going to give you two links that I find useful to anyone trying to avoid the dreaded Sues.

The Universal Mary-Sue Litmus Test (This one is my favorite by the way! You just check a box and it gives you a total score at the bottom, which is pretty neat.)

The Writer's Mary Sue Test (This one is not too bad, but not as lengthy or as detailed as the first one, but please check it out!)

I'd also like to hear any of your opinions on why you hate Mary or Gary Sues. What do you hate most about them? Why are they so popular these days?

I tried to take both of those tests, but I don't think I even made it halfway on either of them. First of all, I maybe checked off one or two, and I thought it was a stupid question. "Does your character share your gender?" Yeah, so? Plus, it's pretty clear after about three questions what the "right" answers are.

Not that I disagree with your opinion--quite the opposite. And I dislike these types of characters because they're not really characters. Take Bella Swan, she doesn't grow, change, learn any life-changing lessons, or otherwise do anything except stare at Edward. There's zero character development. So why do people like those types of books? Because they're entertaining. That's all they need to be.

I definitely agree that Twilight is not good literature. The characters are thin, shallow, and predictable. The plot is thin, shallow, and predictable. And the writing itself is in no way compelling or poignant.

But I've read all the books, and up until the ending of Breaking Dawn, I enjoyed them for their entertainment value. But then the ending of Breaking Dawn was the last straw for me. It ruined my entire enjoyment of the series, for no other reason than the fact that it was not entertaining.

I think most people know to aviod Mary sues. Why write about such a character? For me part of the buzz of writing comes from having characters that do things that most people in the real world would be outraged, disgusted, upset by, afraid of, etc

If you write a character that is overwhelmingly "nice" then you need to add some devious twist at the end to show they were having the other characters on in order to manipulate, and you would need to drop some hint of this early on.

Originally Posted by WDLady

Why are they so popular these days?

Are they popular? Other than Bella, do you have a few other examples?

I would say Bella from Twilight is more like a non character. She has no drive (other than her lust for Edward).

WD Lady, thanks for the Mary Sue tests. Very interesting.

I laughed as I tried to apply the test to some of my characters. The one question, Did you give your characters names you would have named your children? hit home. Boy, that was unfair!! I really liked those names. (joke)

I started the first test, and it was taking so darn long! I checked about 1/2 of the first questions, but when I got to about 20 I was checking none. So, I simply stopped.

I too find Mary Sue characters extremely annoying. Usually my plots are all ABOUT some negative quality about them, usually they have low self esteem, and I've written a few where they're too cocky. I try to give them negative qualities so people can actually relate to the character. That's why Disney movies annoy me... yuck, them princesses are too perfect!

I would point out that Bella is not a Mary Sue. That is, Bella is not the author. Bella is a surrogate for the reader, which is a pretty common thing in romance novels, I understand. She is probably only unique in that she's not a character in a novel written for 40-something homemakers.