A Prime Example of where not to submit - Writers Forum

SeattleGhostWriter · 06-13-2008, 11:31 AM

I am browsing Craigslist. They have a three links regarding Writing. One in the Job Section, another in Gigs and another in Services. I clicked the link for writing gigs and came across another link that took me to a Chicago area Craigslist.

I read the open call for submissions for a new EZine. Frankly, it was more of a rant than a professional open call for submissions. This gent started laughing so hard that I kept reading. It is like an accident on the freeway and everyone is slowing down. Me, I stopped, read, laughed and now am posting this here as a Tip and an Advice for those who are looking to submit their work.

I am posting the ad in its entirety, but the point of this post is that when you read an ad like this, it literally screams amatuerity and a lack of understanding when it comes to the publishing industry standards.

Here is the Ad

Quote:

I've had enough.

I'm a reader, a literature junkie.

I am perpetually shocked by the crap that editors choose to publish these days. It has compelled me to start my own fiction magzine.

I invite writers who have been unable to get their work published to try here. Chances are, if you've gotten nothing but rejection letters, you're either terrible or totally radical and showing these dumbass editors something they've never seen before and therefore don't understand.

If you're terrible, send it along anyway. I'll politely say 'no thanks.'

If you're writing fiction that will be hailed as revolutionary 100 years from now, send it along. I'll probably publish it.

Here are the basic parameters:

In the beginning, I can only afford to publish this online. Therefore, let's not torture Internet readers. Keep your stories to 2000 words or less. Frankly, I feel most stories can be told within 2000 words anyway, so this shouldn't be too constraining.

Please send me something original. An updating of a Bible story is not something I consider original. A mish-mash of the Brady Bunch and your favorite Radiohead song conceptualized as a short story is not something I consider original. The tender tale of a lesbian teenager trying to get her parents to understand her lifestyle is not something I consider original.

What's original?

Good question. Original is something both hated and embraced by anyone who slaps a label to his or her forehead. That means it can't be called liberal. It can't be called conservative. It is a point of view that is TOTALLY NEW.

Original is that which has not been tried before.

Are you one of these poor folks who says "there are no original ideas"? Stop reading this ad right now and move on! My magazine is a place for evolution, not stagnant reflections of the past.

Do not send me reworkings of oedipus. Freud was full of shit. Time to move on.

Get it?

ORIGINAL.

The magazine is called: LitCity Magazine.

The website will be up and running soon.

Please send your work as an attachment (.doc) as well as part of the email itself.

I am not accepting poetry at this time. That may change, I'll let you know.

VERY IMPORTANT:

This CL ad should answer all relevant questions. Do not send me an email demanding more information. I will delete it.

At this time there is no pay other than getting your work published by someone who is not related to you or sleeping with you. I am paying for this venture out of my own pocket. I am a blue-collar worker so that means I have no extra money to begin with. I apologize for this fact but your work will be published in an official forum and you can put that on your resume for later use.

Thank you and I look forward to reading your work,

Stan Rutgers,
Editor
LitCity Magazine

Any person who claims to be an Editor and says that the ad answers all relevant question and not to email any further questions is the biggest red flag that should tell you to run far far away and don't worry about this type of avenue for submission.

Questions writers ought to ask is this:

What rights are you offering when my work is published?

How many works have you published?

What types of works do you publish?

Also, the fact that he says he wants only Original works does not understand that there are only 20 master story plots that all stories have and are written under.

In all reality, to say something has to be 100% original shows a lack and disregard to the nature of writing and creativity. While the story may not be original, the authors voice, style, characters and over all plot structure are very original, fresh and new.

Seriously, how many romance novels are based on the same plot and story line? All of them.

How many mystery novels are built on the same basic plot and story line? Every single one of them.

How many horror stories? Every single one of them.

Again, if you come across this type of ad that says they only accept Original stories and then describe the types of stories they don't consider original, they are showing their lack of understanding when it comes to writing.

What I find even more entertaining is that this Editor admits openly that he is a Blue Collar worker.

Dare I send an email asking what type of publishing credentials and editorial experience he has?

I am afraid (just as he states in his ad) all relevant questions has been answered. Unfortunatley, and sadly, this is a prime example of where not to submit your work.

Sam Winchester · 06-13-2008, 11:40 AM

No, you should submit your work to The Oddville Press! Zing!

Seriously, though, the warning bells started going off in my head after the first two sentences.

Off Topic:

Hey, Mike, looks like we've got more shit... em... I mean "competition" on the horizon.

seigfried007 · 06-13-2008, 12:02 PM

LOL Sam!

One of my first flags was the "magzine" typo. Beyond that.. well... I'd write but I have to drop a load of competition

SeattleGhostWriter · 06-13-2008, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Winchester

No, you should submit your work to The Oddville Press! Zing!

Seriously, though, the warning bells started going off in my head after the first two sentences.

Off Topic:

Hey, Mike, looks like we've got more shit... em... I mean "competition" on the horizon.

I know, but the reality is that some people who are naive about the writing industry and publishing field do not understand that it is postings like the ad mentioned where they get into trouble. Thus, the reason I bring it up here to discuss.

In fact, thinking of actually blogging an article based on this particular ad. How dangerous and why these types of ads ought to be avoided. For me, I found it funny.

Remedy · 06-14-2008, 02:03 AM

Sounds more like a whining teenager who keeps getting rejection letters to me. 'But I'm great! My story about emo Suzie is too good for them! It's all their fault! They don't know talent when they see it! Waah!... Wait, I know - I'll become famous with my own magazine and they'll worship my feet!'

The worst part is, I bet people will submit too. There are unforunately others out there like him who are simply unable to accept the publishing industry. One would hope that decent, non-angsty, non-"radical" writers would see the flags, but perhaps not.

His statement about the label makes me laugh. He slapped a label on his own forehead almost immediately; I wonder if he realizes that.

Mike C · 06-14-2008, 03:13 AM

Actually I can sympathise with the dude to an extent. When NFG folded, Kaolin, Sue and myself had already been having discussions on what a 'real' mag should be about. We were wild and passionate and tota-fuckin-lutely committed to creating something new, shiny and vibrant, and early drafts of our manifesto and sub guidelines were verging on the rant - not against editors, though, but against writers. Sadly the big problem in the system isn't the big bad editor - they're just a bunch of people who want to find a good story, and want more than anything to be impressed - but writers. Boring stories. Twist endings thrown on because they didn't know how else to end it. Bad writing. Derivative plots. The belief that 'experimental' just means not using capitals. The list is endless.

My rant was against all the writers that thought second best was good enough, that submitted tired old stories which suggested they didn't actually read much, the mundane, the cliché, the trite. There are a few bad editors out there for sure, but there's way more bad writers.

The Backward OX · 06-14-2008, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike C

Twist endings thrown on because they didn't know how else to end it.

Perhaps you might be able to contribute something here http://www.writingforums.com/tips-ad...ing-story.html

flashgordon · 06-21-2008, 12:14 PM

Does this so-called literary zine have a website? Sure seems odd not to, especially if it is only publishing online at the moment. Craigslist is full of these, most just posting ads to get backlinks or to get free content from suckers who submit.

Pete_C · 06-25-2008, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Winchester

Off Topic:

Hey, Mike, looks like we've got more shit... em... I mean "competition" on the horizon.

Unprofessional.

He's published nothing yet. You've published nothing yet. He didn't attack you, so why call his project shit? How would you like it if someone from another project called Oddville shit? What makes what you're doing better than what he's doing?

lin · 06-25-2008, 11:29 AM

Hilarious.

Anytime you run into people who are more interesting in telling you their manifesto than what they want from you it's well to stay clear.

I ran into a small book publisher that had a big manifesto against the evils of publishing and how they didn't stand for that shit because they were cooler.

They did seem pretty cool so I sent them a pre-query. I admired their site, titles and approach and said so.
In it I happened to ask if they planned on expanding to sell off amazon, rather than just their own site.

I got back a page of furious screeching about how evil commercialism is and if I thought amazon was better than they were I should take my manuscript to moloch or stick it up my ass. And anyway they already HAD a book like the one I'd quickly described (my state interest in contacting them) so they sure as hell didn't me.

lin · 06-25-2008, 11:30 AM

An ezine with not website.

Wow, that's pretty existential.

David Reinold · 06-29-2008, 05:54 PM

oh wow.

if the only novel of late he's seen is Eragon/Eldest, yeah it's going to seem as though nothing is original.

Quote:

One of my first flags was the "magzine" typo. Beyond that.. well... I'd write but I have to drop a load of competition

Almost as much of a red flag as the everpopular "Copywrite" mistake. be glad he didn't say anything about copyright, he might have been dumb enough to call it that. but then, the fact that he said nothing about copyright again raises a huge red flag.

Fawn Neun · 06-30-2008, 10:46 PM

Like Mike C, I can sympathize with the man's frustration - but - 2000 words max? Most stories can be told in less than 2000 words. Telling them WELL in less than 2000 is another thing, entirely.

I have to say, I'm not tempted to send him anything.