Writers Beware - Writers Forum

CaliWave81 · 08-14-2004, 06:07 PM

I have found a couple of sites that may be of interest to those of you who are seeking out agents or publishers. Before you begin or continue your search, check out these sites to see if the agent or publisher you're thinking of contacting is being warned about.
www.sfwa.org/beware

http://www.proofpositive.com/writers/beware.htm

http://www.sff.net/people/victoriastrauss/beware.html

I hope these sites help.

CaliWave81

Selorian · 08-14-2004, 07:01 PM

Thanks for the heads up and the links.

Novicewriter · 08-14-2004, 07:57 PM

Thanks for the information Caliwave.... What about publish america? I checked them out and I think they are pretty good...

Novicewriter

sully474 · 08-14-2004, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Why are we so vulnerable? Because we WANT to get published. We WANT to see our names in print ... and dream of walking into that bookstore and seeing the promotional rack stacked high with OUR best seller.

That is so true. Good links

eleutheromaniac · 08-15-2004, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Authors who pay to publish are not taken seriously.

You mean like Friedrich Nietzsche?

'There's a flip-side to that coin.' Check out the 'Published' thread.

Yes big time publishers do have more money to throw around then do 'Vanity Presses', but the bottom-line is this: Is the book worth reading?

Hollywood has a lot of money to throw around, as well. But was 'Van Helsing' a better movie than, for example, Swingers, which was an independent film made on a very limited budget? And if anyone says yes, shoot me now.

Yes, many independent movies are badly made, just as many POD-published authors are bad writers. I said it before in the published thread: Anyone can get published now, but just because you can doesn't mean you should. Call me arrogant, but I had absolute confidence in my writing abilities when I chose to publish with AuthorHouse. And many people, on this forum and elsewhere, have echoed that sentiment. Unless you are equally confident in your ability and the quality of your work, DO NOT self-publish, or use a so-called 'Vanity Press'.

And it is possible to crack the top-sellers list using a POD-publisher, it has been done at least a few times that I am aware of. I'm not going to lie, it doesn't happen often, but there are many reasons for that, which were discussed in the published thread.

Also, keep in mind that some sources --check that, ALL sources on the interenet are biased. I too am biased. Make up your own mind. Do your own research and decide for yourself what is best for YOU.

Selorian · 08-15-2004, 08:10 AM

Just out of curiousity, has anybody heard anything about Trafford Publishing www.trafford.com ?
Was just doing a search on POD Publishers and this one caught my interest. Thanks for any info.

CaliWave81 · 08-15-2004, 07:02 PM

No problem on sharing these links. I thought writers should have this information as well.

Eleutheromaniac is right about not trying self-publishing. I too have gone through AuthorHouse, formerly 1st Books, and my co-authored book is a flop in the market. The book itself is only available online at the major outlets and this doesn't help in the amount books that could be sold if only they were on the shelves. Also when I published my book, editorial services weren't available so there are a lot of mistakes. The book is now being re-done and my co-author and I are taking the traditional publishing route this time around.

eleutheromaniac · 08-15-2004, 10:11 PM

Editing wasn't a problem for me, as I had an editor friend who offered to do it for free. Also, I have taken courses in editing myself, and will soon be starting up an editing business called Buck-a-Page, which will cost about 1/5 as much as most copy editing services. I'll put up a thread in the Ads forum as soon as it's up and running.

Also, did you do anything to sell your book? Whether or not you go the 'traditional' route, or use a POD-publisher, you are the main person responsible for selling your book. I think the mistake a lot of writers make is that they expect that once they are finished writing, their job is over. In truth, your job has just begun.

There's a couple of reasons I didn't want to deal with the 'traditional' publishers: 1) I wanted full control over the book and its contents, which is something you don't have with big publishing houses. I didn't want to see my work mangled by people who didn't understand it. 2) It was unlikey that they would have accepted such an unconvential work as mine, even the big name writers have difficulty getting their more controversial books into print, and getting their publishers to fully back them.

The problem with most POD-published writers is that they don't know what they're getting into. There are many books that are very poorly written, as I mentioned in the published thread. That means that you will have an uphill battle to prove that your book is better than the rest. But this is true no matter how you choose to get your work into print.

As far as getting the book into stores, I recommend buying a policy with a book return program, which is an absolute essential to most booksellers. I haven't done this yet myself, I want to build up a base on the internet first, and generate some interest and reviews.

Airborneguy · 08-16-2004, 07:59 AM

First off...Buck 'a Page will be up once I get through some long work days because of the Republican Convention. I'm still with you Eleuth!

My First Sergeant from the Army published a book using Trafford. Nice book, thick stock paper, nice over. BUT, I read it an noticed a ton of errors. I haven't spoken to him (he retired before the book came out), but I believe he may have told them to keep his errors, as the whole theme of the book was, "I am just a normal guy, telling my story." But, I tend to doubt that, so I think they are lacking when it comes to the editing department. I checked them out also, but decided that I didn't want to pay to publish my book.

CaliWave81 · 08-20-2004, 08:58 PM

I must admit, Eleutheromaniac, that I didn't do much to promote book. Why? Because, after I saw all of the errors I lost a lot my confidence in it. I didn't want to promote a book with that many errors and have others see it. All I could think about was what others would think if they saw "raw" material such as what they're not used when a book is run through the traditional houses. Unfortunately, I didn't have an editor friend and I had no money with which to hire an editor. Some of their rates are phenomenal! I guess that's one of the reasons I chose the traditional route because many houses have in-house editors that don't expect money up front but get paid from the sales of the book just like the publishers and author do. Sounded to me like the better choice from where I stand.

eleutheromaniac · 08-22-2004, 08:47 AM

I'm sorry about all the errors in your book. Editing is a difficult process. Keep in mind, I've seen several errors in traditionally published books as well. Even reprints of classic works still have a few errors in them! As long as they don't take away from the work, it's not that big of a deal.

I'd say one typo/mistake for every....say, 2000 words is acceptable (as long as it's not a big mistake, just something like a missing comma or a run-on sentence). Any thoughts?

It's interesting that you mention editors' pricing (AuthorHouse was offering copy editing services for 5 bucks a page). That's why me and Airborne are starting up Buck-a-Page. 1/5 the cost. While we won't have the expertise of some other editing services, I think people who use us will be happy with the results.

CaliWave81 · 08-23-2004, 11:22 AM

I understand that not all errors can be caught and an error or two for every 2,000 words isn't bad. However, in my book there are errors on every couple of pages. The amount of errors was enough for me not to want to promote the book.

Airborneguy · 08-23-2004, 06:15 PM

Traditional Publisher:

Agent: 15%
Editor: ?%

POD:

Royalties: All me

That's the way I look at it. I'd rather do the work myself.

CaliWave81 · 01-09-2006, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Novicewriter

Thanks for the information Caliwave.... What about publish america? I checked them out and I think they are pretty good...

Novicewriter

I can't believe it's been so long since I've read through some of my posts. I know it's probably too late to tell you this now but Publish America has had some warning out about it. I found this at http://www.sfwa.org/beware/general.html#PA

The Great PublishAmerica Hoax
A number of SFWA members have perpetrated a diabolical hoax upon PublishAmerica, a print-on-demand-based vanity publisher that poses as a "traditional" publisher in order to ensnare thousands of gullible first-time writers.

Most of the writers' advocates providing warnings about this company are speculative fiction writers. After PublishAmerica posted a venomous screed against science fiction and fantasy writers at its AuthorsMarket.net website ("...writers who erroneously believe that SciFi, because it is set in a distant future, does not require believable storylines, or that Fantasy, because it is set in conditions that have never existed, does not need believable every-day characters"), a bunch of us wretched hacks decided to see how high a bar the supposedly selective PublishAmerica sets for its own books. Over the course of a weekend, thirty professional science fiction and fantasy writers and editors sat down and each banged out a chapter of a deliberately unpublishable opus entitled Atlanta Nights. Guess what: PublishAmerica accepted it.

Writer Beware has received more than 100 complaints about PublishAmerica over the past few years. One PublishAmerica author recently won a judgment in an arbitration proceeding against PublishAmerica; the difficulties he experienced are typical of the complaints we've seen.

Another good site to visit is http://authorslawyer.com/l-publishers.shtml#pa

Sorry I'm so VERY late in responding.

CaliWave81 · 01-09-2006, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by selorian72

Just out of curiousity, has anybody heard anything about Trafford Publishing www.trafford.com ?
Was just doing a search on POD Publishers and this one caught my interest. Thanks for any info.

So far I haven't come across any warnings about Trafford Publishing but if I do I will let you know. I did find some useful information that will help you choose which POD to use. Here is the link: http://julieduffy.com/writing/pod_04.htm

I hope this helps.

Cali