The Backward OX

All you pretentious little twats who post supposed literature here are interested in only one thing - staying on the constantly-revolving wheel of telling each other all manner of jargon crap.

You are not writing for readers. And because the only feedback you ever get is from other pompous and conceited asses who pretend to know about writing, you will never learn what readers want.

When did you ever hear a reader rabbiting on about protagonists and narrators and third-person omni and voice and all the rest of that garbage?

You pretend story writers are barely more evolved than the pretend poets in the poetry forum.

For Chrissakes – when you slide behind the wheel of your car to drive to the store, you don’t give a f*ck that it has a d.o.h.c engine, MacPherson struts, rack-and-pinion steering, and a dual-throat Weber. You just want to get from A to B.

Same with a book. The reader doesn’t care what it’s made of.

Regarding “Show, don’t tell”, here’s one of the facts of life. I’ve polled this issue with a real reader - one who has read somewhere between seven and ten thousand novels - and her summary is that she hates padding. She would prefer one sentence telling her “Fred was scared” rather than two paragraphs – or even one - in which he demonstrated his feelings. Now, if she’s like that about her reading preferences, there have to be millions more just like her, out there in Readers’ World.

Here's the best part - if this rule is no more than an urban myth, probably so are most other rules about how to craft a readable book.

I suggest you go out on a limb. Write your freakin book and take it to a publisher. Staying here in this warm little womb is identical with the guy who says he’s trying to give up smoking. While ever he has that excuse of “trying” he doesn’t have to bother himself with actually quitting. And you’re just the same. While ever you keep asking for feedback, and filling each other full of bullshit –“I see you’re still experimenting with your voice” - on a regular basis, you don’t need to take that giant step.

Writers write. Posers come here.

Bah.

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JHB

Dammit! *sweeps work into trash*

Rumrunner

True, perhaps -- but I'll wager most people want to be bloody sure that the mechanic who built the thing knew and cared about all that. And that's what the writer essentially is.

Any field producing a product for consumption has it's own behind-the-scenes "jargon" that the average end consumer doesn't care about. But that doesn't mean that jargon doesn't have a place.

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Aevin

Knowing what will attract an audience is an important part of writing skill.

Which is to say, even what you've mentioned is part of the "jargon," and can be learned here.

I take it in calling others pretentious and conceited, you mean you're above all of that? Pretentious, indeed.

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Non Serviam

Wherever would we be without the benefit of your opinion on so many things, TBO?

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Mike C

Pretentious? Moi?

Ox, as usual you miss the point by a mile. If we dispense with the jargon, which is really just a writers metalanguage, something we use so we all understand eachother, then how do we discuss what we do?

If I was a mechanic would you call me pretentious for calling a spanner a spanner?

What a pointless, pretentious rant.

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lin

Trouble is SO much of writing jargon doesn't have a referent as clearly defined as a spanner is. Half of it people can't even agree on what it means.

What I don't get about Ox's ramble is that he's talking about people who actually write things and post them. Not like the non-painters lolling around coffeehouses in paint smeared jeans and talking about Capital A Art.

There are lots of people here who are on a writing site but aren't even writer's at all. Or are afraid to show their work, which amounts to the same thing. And not just people like Hodge who come here only to argue, I mean those who claim to be writers when it's pretty obvious from their posts that they can't and never post any work.

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Pete_C

Ox, usually I think you're funny. Now I think you're trying too hard.

Talia_Brie

Ox, you are what we in Australia affectionately call a Knob.

That's not a compliment.

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Lote-Tree

Write for yourself! And if readers enjoy what you write then thats a bonus!

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ieuan

Ox wrote: Writers write. Posers come here.

So what are you saying big man, you are a poser?

ClancyBoy

Professionals all use jargon that relates to their craft. Does someone who drives a car know about the friction coefficients of different kinds of disk brakes? Probably not, but by God the engineers at the big auto companies better.

That doesn't make them pretentious, it makes them specialized.

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ClancyBoy

Yes, because it's called a wrench dammit.

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"Mother Hitton's Littul Kittons wait for you down there. Little pets they are, little little little pets. Cute little things, they say. Don't you believe it. No man ever saw them and walked away alive. You won't either. That's the final dash, flash. That's the utter clobber, cobber." --Cordwainer Smith, Norstrillia.

winkash

Intellectual activities are only for those who enjoy their solitude. Seen from outside, writing and art in general must seem exciting but there is a harsh lonely stage posers want to skip to somewhat experience the nice one. I reckon they come here to do as if they were writers without actually taking the pain of being writers. I'm not especially fond of making an eulogy to sacrifice and hard work, but IMO this is the only way it works.
On the other hand, anyone has the right to pretend whatever they please. As far as I'm concerned, I haven't read any notice stating Posers are not welcome. Maybe they start posing in WT to end up acting or writing screenplays.
So, I agree with you OX, which by no means means that I'm going to give a thorough explanation about my reasons for being here.

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Selorian

If all I want to do is drive a car, then I don't need to know how they're built. But if I want to restore or build one, then I damn well need to know all that technical stuff most people never know. It's the same with books. If I just want to read, I don't need to understand how they are put together. But if I want to write one myself, that people will actually read, then I need to know all about plot, voice, pov, pacing, and all the other techniques and tools of the craft.

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