aspiring

As a children's author, I take great exception to your assumption.

I also think that's an incredibly skewed point of view. How many writers out there are interested in creating something 'great or profound' as opposed to actually being published? Since when is everyone supposed to be aiming for 'high level literature'?

Fantasy of You

Thanks for being nice enough to dumb down your vocab. for me, Kimba, what with us teenagers being morons and all... If you really do dumb down your writing for teenagers, and you weren't purposely trying to be condescending, any teenager who reads your drivel will dumb down their crit. and tell you your work was 'really, really bad'

I roll my eyes.

It's not about the word length, it's about the fluidity of the prose. People who use big words for its own sake will usually sacrifice fluidity for it, and mark themselves out at idiots.

The relatively infantile youth advanced his gluteus maximus upon the augmented plastic seating facility.

Or..

The kid sat down.

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friendly

Many times I have been told that my writing is complicated to understand and that I write only for myself to understand. I tried toning it down, writing like a stupid(if that's what you call dumb your own writing) but I never felt easy doing it. I reverted back to my old style-whether anyone likes it or not. They probably think that I suck as a writer.

Foxee

Nice illustration, Fantasy of You (I got a chuckle out of it). Actually, you sorta made my point about the term 'dumbing down'... I sure wouldn't want people to feel they had to 'dumb down' writing for me either.

I liked the children's book author who posted earlier (sorry, the past posts thingie doesn't reach back that far) and said they go ahead and use a word that might be new to their readers and then gently explain it.

And, no matter what or who you're writing for, good context never hurt anybody.

FrankBlissett

Fantasy hit it dead-on with his example. Simplifying does NOT mean "stupid". Nor does expanding mean "pretensious". That is, unless you're writing in a stupid or a pretensious manner.

Writing for oneself is all well and good, but if chosing to write for an audience then keep in mind whether the flow of the prose will cause the reader to trip up or to glaze over. Fortunately, that can usually be done by reading what you write after you write it.

-Frank

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mammamaia

Quote:

Do you ever dumb down your writing?

sure, i do!...every day [in my board/forum posts! ]

seriously, pretty much any seasoned writer who writes in more than one genre/medium for a variety of target markets will be 'adjusting' her/his writing style to fit the needs/preferences of the venues they hope to hook and the 'audience' they hope will be reading/seeing their work...

don't know that i'd be rude enough to call it 'dumbing down' though... no one would expect a versatile writer to write the same way in both a scholarly treatise and a short story for a popular magazine... or for business ad copy and a philosophical essay... or for a child's picture book and an adult novel... or a stage musical comedy and a sci-fi movie script...

i've written all of the above and none were done with the same style or 'level' of writing, whatever you want to call that... i call it being a good writer... if any want to call it a mix of 'dumbing down' and my 'natural,' more 'intellectual' writing level, that's their problem...

with deepest affection and warm embraces, maia

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CroZ

It depends on the language, I don't know enough about the ones you posted but english letters don't account for every language.
eg. in Sicherheitsgurt, Sic could be one letter on its own, but because we don't have a letter Sic or use their character we spell it S-I-C and so it looks longer.

Take Japanese -
Watashi wa pan o tabemasu
isnt a collection of English characters but the ENG equivelent of the Japanese characters.
Wa - is a letter on its own
so is 'Ta'

Wa-ta-shi wa pa-n o ta-be-ma-su
only these would be written in Hiragana
hi-ra-ga-na
and it depends on pronounciation as well.

theflowerofcarnage

I used to post up my stories on a site that was comprised of fangirls. The majority of them were only interested in light reads with little to no depth. Members whose work involved prose were often disregarded. It really upset me when I put effort into my chapters and recieved hardly any responses, but I was told by other members that people usually aren't interested in reading a profound or poignant piece on the computer. No one wants to read work that contains several paragraphs and almost no dialogue. The concept was something I had difficulty grasping onto, because I was pretty obstinate about simplifying my work just to win more readers.

Of course, it did work; only it worked with the ones I didn't enjoy writing.

To me, dumbing yourself down doesn't mean eliminating big words, but creating two-dimensional characters involved in cliched situations. I found it repulsive that I had to concoct plotlines I believed were overused, but I wanted to be appreciated. I was constantly seeking ways of improvement, and if I didn't have readers to respond, how could I better myself? However, now I realize, what's that point in having people critique something that obviously isn't your best work?

I had trouble adjusting to that particular style of writing, so I decided to throw it away.

Your target audience should be those who read your work and like it. That's what I think.

Also, I was little offended by Kimba's comment about having to dumb down work for teenagers. Why do you have to pigeonhole us that way? Because we can't yet be categorized as adults, then that means we're illiterate? That assumption is really quite ridiculous. I have a sixteen year old friend who reads the same books adults do, as do I. Don't make those kinds of generalisations about us.

I really don't think dumbing yourself down is an obligation for writing a children's book either. I don't think it's easy for an adult author to get into a child's mind. Our memories of our childhood is quite obscure, we can't clearly remember how our minds worked when we were four. To write something that would interest a child that young requires skill and creativity.

mashowasho

I suppose it depends who your target audience are. It is possible to dumb down the language anyway without becoming patronising.

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Mike C

No it's not. the term 'dumbing down' itself is patronising. It means writing to the lowest common denominator and assuming your readers are less intelligent than you.

Writers of good YA work don't dumb down. They write intelligent work for intelligent readers. The themes may differ, and stylistically they may differ, but not the quality of writing. If you dumb down for a teenage market, you are patronising them.

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suzakugaiden

"eg. in Sicherheitsgurt, Sic could be one letter on its own, but because we don't have a letter Sic or use their character we spell it S-I-C and so it looks longer."

Uhhhh except this is german, so no. That's not how it works.

Aaaanyway, the majority of teenagers in America would REALLY hate to read a book of length longer than 120 pages. It's not an unfair generalization. But look. The good writers write real books. Nobody is forcing you to read dumbed-down teen books. And besides. The teenagers that willingly read and enjoy dumbed-down teen books really don't deserve to read anything better.

[Maybe I'm just cynical because people just seem to hate reading anymore. WTF?]

KyleColorado

I don't think Kimba meant any offense in her misguided generalization.

That said, I think the writing should be true to itself. The voice should be natural, and if there's an urge to "dumb it down" then the writing will come out diluted.

Like Mike C. said, most readers are smarter than you think.

Kimba

No, I didn't and I sincerely apologize if it did offend anyone. What I meant was in general younger teenagers may have trouble reading too many "big words" in one book. I was referring to teenagers below the age of 15 [which I probably should have emphasized] - hence my question of dumbing the content.

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bob rulz

Why write just to appease more of the teenage audience? Why are the stupid teenagers who don't like reading or only like reading small books worth dealing with when it comes to writing? (This coming from a 16-year old.)

strangedaze

if dumb down means making it a smooth read, then i do it constantly. you can always tell a novice writer by how many useless or needlessly complex words they use. i think the first stage of learning to write is just doing what comes natural, which makes for pared down but audibly pleasing stuff. then you try playing around a bit, and the results are usually waaay over the top. but then you learn how to create a perfect balance.

kaboom.

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