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Old 11-18-2005, 08:51 PM   #1
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Need pointers...

1. How do I avoid over using words like, he said, he mumbled, he supplied.
Usually i'm able to do it when i'm caught in the flow but now that i'm revising an older work I can't seem to think of anything to put in there place and it all just seems a little dry.

2. One of my stories takes place throughout a modern city but my problem is that most of the locations are alleys, sidewalks and subways which as you might have guessed all look the same and if I keep describing them over and over again it just seems to get really repetitive, would it be okay to just mention that its a subway.etc with just maybe a one line description of what they look like. Oh and i'm not saying that its the same places over and over again either.

3. For a long winded conversation between four characters do I have to keep on mentioning who's speaking over and over again to avoid confusion?
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Old 11-18-2005, 10:22 PM   #2
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Quote:
How do I avoid over using words like, he said, he mumbled, he supplied.
Usually i'm able to do it when i'm caught in the flow but now that i'm revising an older work I can't seem to think of anything to put in there place and it all just seems a little dry.
All I can say is use a thesorus.

Quote:
One of my stories takes place throughout a modern city but my problem is that most of the locations are alleys, sidewalks and subways which as you might have guessed all look the same and if I keep describing them over and over again it just seems to get really repetitive, would it be okay to just mention that its a subway.etc with just maybe a one line description of what they look like. Oh and i'm not saying that its the same places over and over again either.
I would just try changing the locations if possible (if they are in an alley so that no one can see them, then try putting them behind a store instaed, stuff like that). The fact that you keep using the same kind of place tells me that you are probably dropping the creative ball when it comes to locations. Something that I still have trouble learning is that locations REALLY help make the mood. If everything is just subways, alleys, boring sidewalks, everything probably feels the same, and not many people want to feel the same way through a whole book/story/whateverm they want to have their emotions change as they experience new things. If you do everything in an alley, wether its murder or a drug deal, they both feel the same way.

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For a long winded conversation between four characters do I have to keep on mentioning who's speaking over and over again to avoid confusion?
Maybe. It al depends on if a group of people aren't changing the order of when who talks. But if theres more than two people, I usually try to say whos talking a lot. But when there is only two it gets repetive. Without reading it I wouldn't know absolutley what you should do.
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Old 11-18-2005, 11:48 PM   #3
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For multiple people, you could always generalize what they say and slip in quotation only when neccessary.
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Old 11-19-2005, 09:02 AM   #4
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please don't use a thesaurus!... 'said' or 'mumbled' are ok, but using a plethora of substitutions like 'supplied' and other stuff you'll find in the thesaurus will only mark you as an amateur... take a good look at the work of the best writers and you'll find the near-invisible 'said' is really all that's needed in most cases...

for conversations, you don't have to use it for every line of dialog, but just often enough to not confuse the reader as to who's speaking... there's a thread somewhere on the forum that deals with this problem... see if you can find it and read all the input on the subject from our members...

then, google for advice on the subject, if you're still not convinced that 'said' is good enough... here's just one article on the problem:




Quote:
Dialog Tags

An article in Writer's Digest, Who Said That?, continues the controversy about using dialog tags. Some contemporary writers eschew any attribution other than "said" and "asked". Author Nancy Kress admits a pageful of them can be boring, but warns that using synonyms can also be distracting.
But when used reasonably, readers don't actually notice dialogue tags; they should blend into the page. Some words that identify tone of voice can sharpen the reader's mental image without calling undue attention to themselves. These include "shouted," "whispered," "gasped" and "murmured."
Sometimes writers try to skirt the issue adverbially, using a modifying adverb after a plain tag. They risk being hooted out of their critique groups as "Tom Swiftie" creators. Another alternative is to omit tags completely, which works fine until the characters get deep into a runaway conversation and readers begin to wonder "who said that"?
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Old 11-19-2005, 06:27 PM   #5
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Ejaculated is the only valid synonym for said. This is fact.

Anyway, something odd I've noticed. In my NaNo, I actually AM using dialogue tags other than said. Primarily shouted, I guess. I don't really know why. There's not cognitive reason for it, per se. It just seems appropriate.

And there was one point when I think I used three in a row ("_____," I said, shouted, and emoted). It sounds a helluva lot better in context.
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Old 11-19-2005, 06:55 PM   #6
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I agree with mammamia about finding synonyms for said. Also try to avoid adding adverbs to said: she said sarcastically, he said softly, he said angrily, etc. These are also considered to be marks of an amateur (not that I'm calling you an amateur, of course!) as the dialogue and context should be able to speak for itself.

Regarding the alleys, no, you don't need to paint an overall description of each individual alley. What you could do is focus in on small details in these alley/sidewalk/subway scenes. For example, the character could notice an advertisement in the subway that will remind him/her of something important. Or else, you could use these scenes for emotional development of your characters.

As for conversations with four characters, I would say yes, you should always identify who is speaking unless all four of your characters have such obviously distinctive speaking styles (unmistakable accents, favorite sayings or words) that the reader cannot possibly get confused. In a dialogue with two people, the reader SHOULD be able to keep of who is speaking without identifiers, but it gets a lot more confusing with four people, especially since they are not going to all speak in turn.
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Old 11-20-2005, 03:58 PM   #7
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Thanks but theres just one more thing...
I know your meant to fit your story into a genre but what are you meant to do if it dosent fit in anywhere... just refer to it as non-genre?
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Old 11-20-2005, 08:32 PM   #8
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I don't think there's any such thing as a non-genre. It may not be an obvious genre like sci-fi or fantasy, but it still belongs to some genre out there. Could it fit in any of the following?

-mainstream
-literary
-experimental
-dark fiction
-action/suspense
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Old 11-20-2005, 08:47 PM   #9
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Well its a sort of a Modern Adventure/Christmass miracle (Only in the sense that it happens on Christmass, no reindeers and magic)
I'm afraid to say its an Adventure tail in case they assume its a fantasy style sword and sandals sort of thing.
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