My Damn Disastrous Dialogue - Writers Forum

scifi maniac · 11-08-2005, 02:05 AM

Ok. I'm one of those people who just never gets it right. Everytime I ask this question, the answer is 'Say it aloud, does it sound corny?' Doing that just ain't cutting the mark, sorry to say. I need help with my dialogue. Everything about it is stupid rubbish. I rarely diverge from "he said, she said, he whispered, she whispered, he yelled, she yelled" etc. etc. etc. To use a grin would be a rare achievement in its own rite. Please help me with dialogue tips otherwise nothing I write will every be acceptable.

Hodge · 11-08-2005, 02:09 AM

Nothing to it, really... Just write how you talk.

People don't say, "Hello, my name is Josh and I enjoy the sedentary lifesetyle."

People do say, "Hey, I'm Josh and I like to sit on my ass."

And some people even say, "Yo, wazzup in the hizz-ouse, dawg? Mah name is Josh and I be chillin, G. Don't be hatin'."

Edit: modifiers aren't terribly important. Sometimes you'll need to use one, but generally "said" is what you'll use for 90% of your dialogue (and if you have two characters conversing you probably don't need tags on more than two lines of dialogue).

Non-verbal communication can be important, though. Just imagine how your character would react to the given situation.

PamHKyle · 11-08-2005, 02:54 AM

hi maniac,
I have (had) the same problem.
You might want to check out this site: http://teenwriting.about.com/od/dialogue
You'll find lots of articles on the problem and suggestions for sollutions. It really helped me.
They've also got loads of articles on all other kinds of writing problems.
Regards,
Pam

bheid1.01 · 11-08-2005, 02:55 AM

i don't see how dialogue can be hard, just write how people talk

i use said most of the time, although i may do this; "hello" he said with a smile

scifi maniac · 11-08-2005, 04:30 AM

That teenwriting site is really good PamHKyle, thanks for the tip.

scifi maniac · 11-08-2005, 04:33 AM

And to Hodge and Bheid 1.01: I found on that site that it is actually a bad idea to talk like you would in real life. Normal speech is boring and repetitive, and the way you should write in fiction is 'pretend' real speech; just less repetetive dialogue only containing necessary information for the story.

mammamaia · 11-08-2005, 07:48 AM

that's true... people really don't speak the way dialog is written in novels and stories... but, when read, if 'feels' like they do... a good writer can cull out all the little digressions we make in our everyday speech, leaving a speech-like core that gets across only what the reader needs to 'hear'...

Schumi · 11-08-2005, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hodge

And some people even say, "Yo, wazzup in the hizz-ouse, dawg? Mah name is Josh and I be chillin, G. Don't be hatin'."

I've been wondering about that. In the novel I am writing, the characters would say 'do you want to go somewhere tonight?' instead of 'do you wanna go somewhere tonight?' Is it okay to use words like wanna in a novel? Is it acceptable to adapt character's speech with slang?

amusinglackoftalent · 11-08-2005, 12:59 PM

From Hodge:Edit: modifiers aren't terribly important. Sometimes you'll need to use one, but generally "said" is what you'll use for 90% of your dialogue (and if you have two characters conversing you probably don't need tags on more than two lines of dialogue).

This is a very good point, Scifi. Something I have found about what I consider to be my better attempts at dialogue is my lack of inclination to use a tag (modifier) as I write. You’ll find yourself in the rhythm of the characters’ interchange to a degree where the tags aren’t at all necessary. They may even serve to interrupt the flow if you’re giving them too much thought. I’m speaking here, of course, about leaving the story behind in such a way that all the reader’s eye can see is the exchange between the characters at the moment. Perhaps you’re ‘trying too hard’. Loosen up and allow the exchange to flow easily. This, for me, comes from knowing my character and what he, or she, should say at any given moment during the story. Your reader knows who is saying what to whom during conversation if you are telling your story well. The ‘he said’, ‘she said’, ‘added with a wink or a smirk’ sometimes aren’t necessary.

From Maia: a good writer can cull out all the little digressions we make in our everyday speech, leaving a speech-like core that gets across only what the reader needs to 'hear'...

Just more back up for my opinion on this. Why add the tags if they don’t move things along? Sometime ago I read an interview in an old Paris Review. It was a compilation of interviews conducted by George Plimpton, so I don’t remember the exact author. I do remember the writer was a female. She refused, as a general rule, to use anything but ‘he said’ or ‘she said’ when she used a tag at all. This is just my opinion, my two cents for what they’re worth, Scifi. I’ve often suspected the most prevalent rule with regard to writing is that there are no ‘rules’. So much of what we’re told seems so darned subjective at times I often wonder how we manage to crank out a decent page when we do. I say this because as bheid pointed out, this often works quite well, too, "Hello," he said with a smile.

I guess it’s all about knowing when and where and that part is all up to you.

Anarkos · 11-08-2005, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scifi maniac

And to Hodge and Bheid 1.01: I found on that site that it is actually a bad idea to talk like you would in real life. Normal speech is boring and repetitive, and the way you should write in fiction is 'pretend' real speech; just less repetetive dialogue only containing necessary information for the story.

Yes and no. It's a bad idea to write slow, boring misunderstandings. However, it is equally tedious to write perfect and plastic conversations. People mishear and misunderstand others, people slip up and use the wrong words, people talk complete rubbish.

Playing on this can be a very good tactic in dialogue. Examples include Irvine Welsh, Chuck Palahniuk, Brett Easton Ellis (read American Psycho), and even Quentin Tarantino's films.

petrel} · 11-08-2005, 01:46 PM

Write like you talk hasn't really been an option for me, since I write better than I talk (always trippin' over my tongue). Of course, you are going to be shaping your dialogue any way you look at it--stories are more like artificial life so naturally the dialogue will be more contrived and condensed than in "real" life. Plus, you can use words delibrately in dialogue to foreshadow or highlight people's attitudes--something you don't really do in reality, except by accident.

I like to think about what kind of a person my character is, what his/her background is, and decide from that what style of language he/she will use. Some characters would never use the words "plethora" or "verbose", but may use trite little sayings (blue as the sky, like a barrel full of monkeys) that are rather cliche just because that is their background or the culture they live in. Others may be more educated and use a "higher" brand of vocabulary. Naturally, it's difficult to write dialogue, but if you have an idea what you want the characters to say and know what the conversation is leading up to, it is much easier to craft the words from the mouths.

Hodge · 11-08-2005, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scifi maniac

And to Hodge and Bheid 1.01: I found on that site that it is actually a bad idea to talk like you would in real life. Normal speech is boring and repetitive, and the way you should write in fiction is 'pretend' real speech; just less repetetive dialogue only containing necessary information for the story.

I don't mean say what you would say in real life, I mean write it how you would say it in real life. People don't speak in a grammatically correct way, and depending on what region you hail from, they generally don't say words the same way. Like Schumi asked, do you say "wanna" or "want to"? It all depends on how your character would say it, because in dialogue grammar and punctuation exist solely for flow and style; normal rules don't apply.