Anidazen

Hi. I very much want to write a book which is quite similar to a certain children's cult phenomenon of late.

Because of the unique setting it's hard to create something which isn't a copycat product, but I do want to differentiate it as much as possible.

I could copy as little as possible. The setting would have another focus similar but NOT the same as wizards, I'm quite proud of it but don't want to say here. It would be set in a secret city rather than a school, and the workings of magic would be a bit less prominent. (Again, it's the changed focus that helps this.)

There is definately a market for this, and I want to write it becuase I really do have that kind of active imagination something like this requires.

The tension would come from what is more of a political struggle than a really-evil-badguy too. I mean, it has badguys, but it's a political war sort of.


I guess what I want to know is, do you think this would be a good idea, and can you give me any advice on doing something like this? It really isn't going to be a clone, just a similar setting to begin the book.

__________________
http://www.samsmith.co.uk - My attempts at light humour columns.

bobothegoat

Could you be more vague? I'm sorry, but I don't exactly understand your concept.

__________________
Bobo the Goat

Anidazen

Sorry.

It's a similar pemise to Harry Potter, a world of wizards and of magic kept secret, and a young boy discovering he is really part of this new world.

But it's something SIMILAR but not the same as wizardry. He lives in this city as an apprentice to the guy who found him, and learns to hone and control his powers, and finds himself involved in a big political struggle. (Good versus Evil ish).


I was just wondering if anyone had any specific advice in creating a book like this.

__________________
http://www.samsmith.co.uk - My attempts at light humour columns.

Talia_Brie

It doesn't sound like a copy of HP, but the most important thing to keep in mind is to be aware of HP, and on the lookout for crossover. Stories of children becoming aware of secret organisations and their own secret powers are definitely out there.

In terms of creating the book, there's lots of ways to do it, but I generally say the first thing is to outline the plot, then create the world on paper (i.e. draw maps, write notes about places and people etc) Once the world itself is reasonably full, start writing the story.

__________________

Nazareth

Simple solution- change the premiss of the book- you can still keep it similiar, but different enough that it will be original- Have the main character experience totally different character conflicts, with different plot objectives & inner conflicts- Change the crisis etc.. I never read harry potter & don't intend to, but to illustrate what I mean, suppose that HP is about:

A boy who learns he's the descendant of a wizard & must keep the craft alive- His inner conflict is the fact that he can't summon the courage needed to go against the evil overlord because as a child, his wicked Aunt did horrible things to him like lock him in dark dungeon (She desperately wanted to keep him from finding out about his inherritence because it would mean that she no longer was the matriarc & she couldn't deal with loss of power.
Anyway, the boy does learn about his destinay through a warlock who is able to go invisible and sneaks to the dungeon to tell the boy (He had orders to instruct the boy, and to teach him the craft)

So, as the boy goes off to find the magic cup (or whatever- somethiung that will allow him to tap his full power) He is opposed by his father's ex nemisis who absolutely hated the father and tried to kill the whole family in order to prevent any further problems- only he failed to kill the son who ended up with the aunt & was protected by a decree from the high priestess while he was growing up- The aunt couldn't kill him, and the nemisis couldn't either- BUT the aunt tried to prevent the boy from ever finding out about his herritage)

(I realize HP isn't about that- but pretend it is)

The above gives you the plot of the story, plus the inner conflict & subplot of the aunt trying to prevent the boy from rising to power, and we got the main plot of the nemisis trying to kill the boy but can't unless the boy steps outside of the high priestesses protection (Which he has to in order to find the cup or whatever)

Alright- To change the basics and still keep it similiar, you could have a boy who has been drugged for twenty years by a group of the overlords lackey's. The overlord knows the boys special destiny, and knows that if the boy ever becomes the wizard he is supposed to become, it would mean that the overlord would would lose his position as overlord over the kingdome. He can't outright kill the boy- (Because if He does, the kings witch would know-) He can however make sure the boy never learns of his destiny. The overlord goes to the king and tells the king the boy is missing, but that he will do everything he can to find the 'poor boy' for the king- but of course he never does 'find' the boy- He's got him captive.
THe boy grows up with pymies in the forrest (Instead of in the castle dungeon like the first story). The boy grows up thinking the world is cruel because the pygmies treat him terrible- and he feels he is destined to die without ever seeing the outside world- Everytime he tries to leave (Something in his mind keeps insisting he must try) he gets captured. Well, one day a gnome gets a message from aone of hte boys long lost cousins or whatever, who knows about the boys special powers & destiny. The cousin tells the gnome (Who is a resident of the forrest by the way) to please get hte boy out- The gnome sneaks into camp one night and awakens the boy- He tries desperately to get hte boy to leave through the secret underground passage- The boy refuses becasue he is so apathetic that he can't muster the strength or will. The Gnome tells him his destiny, but the boy just can't beleive it. Finally, the boy apathetically agrees to at least go to the edge of the kingdome with the Gnome. You could show the dangers they face along the way & how the boy is a real wimp etc, and keeps wilting with fear and just wants to go back to the pygmies (Victims syndrome)

Anyways- they get to the edge of the kingdome- Gnome shows the boy a secret wrist band that can only give a worthy person special powers.

Meanwhile, the pygmies learn that the boy has escaped- they run and cower before the overlord who kills half of them- He then orders hte rest to either bring the boy back or kill themselves.

So- in the second example, we got pretty much the same plot line (Preventing a boy from gaining his real inherritence) but different circumstances- BOTH are as compelling as the other & both will be unique stories with different settings, different inner conflicts. In the second plot- we see the boys inner conflict has changed in that he suffers from victims syndrome, and doesn't want to leave the 'security' of what he knows- The over all plot remains the same- prevent boy from destiny- we have different characvters etc.

Be original enough and I think you'll be fine with your creation- there's plenty of ways to change a story enough that it becomes your own-

I'm actually working on a detective novel that follows the same outline with some of the same inner conflicts as the Godfather, BUT if I hadn't told the reader that- there is no way they would even suspect it because the circumstances are so vastly different-

Jan_Itor

I mingle a lot with the "D&D" community. Needless to say I know from first hand experience those people are like... I don't even know. (And you don't want to know...)

They pick apart EVERYTHING. From Pokemon to the word 'Phat.'* Believe me, in there world, everything is a rip-off of everything else. And sure, they're probably right. Take Star-Wars: A New Hope for example, it's a (semi-)blatant rip-off of Lord of the Rings. Obi-Wan "Dies", Gandalf "Dies" etc. Both of those come right down to mythology. Luke and Harry and Even Superman all come back to Hercules.

I think you should write it and if YOU don't like it, then scrap it. People are always out to get at uber-talanted people like us, just remember that.

Peace,

Jan.


* Cheap excuse to alliterate

playstation60

Could you explain a bit more the supposed relationship between Star Wars: A New Hope and LOTR, Jan?


Ben

__________________
24,372/50,000

Nazareth

Meh Jan- if the D&D community wants to stick their nosde up at everything, then they can just go without enjoying good fiction wether it is similiar to other fiction or not- Must be tough for that comunity to go through life so bitter about evertything lol

eleutheromaniac

I wrote a piece on Homage vs. Rip-off a while back. Might be worth checking out.

http://www.lit.org/view/16875

__________________
Augmented Reality

Crunchy Hamster

Yes - Star Wars was very archetypal and was supposed to be. George Lucas was friends with a man named Joseph Campbell, a Jungian psychologist who specialised in mythology.
Supposedly, they spent many an hour chatting about mythology and archetypes and in this way Cambpell helped Lucas use a number of archetypes in his story - what you could call a "samurai story" - a young boy (Luke) is given a sword (light sabre) by a sword master (Kenobi) and trains to become a samurai under the training of another sword master (Yoda).Even the names show this link.
Another easily recognisable link to archetypes is the character Darth Vader. The word Darth or Daath is actually a hebrew word meaning "the unknown" and is one of the sections or sephira of the Kabbalistic Tree of Life - or Sephiroth.

A little on the life of Joseph Campbell can be found at the following site.
http://www.jcf.org/about_jc.php

I read The Power of Myth and watched some of the interview - Campbell talks extensively about the mythology used in Star Wars and other movies. Fascinating - and goes to show how useful mythology can be in strengthening the power of a story...

__________________
Colours are fragrant, but they fade away.
In this land of ours none last forever.
Today, cross the high mountains of lifes illusion
And there will be no more shallow dreaming, no more drunkeness.

SoulSprinner

There is only supposed to be 24 or 25 plots that can be marketed, myths and ancient stories are freqently adapted into movies. Call it what ever you want but unless your going to pay $11.50 to see Zen Master Hiki-Ori read the samurai's tale on screen don't complain. If that was even what your were doing. I also find it incredibly hard to believe Star Wars is

LOL I love this, you went from samurai's journey or what ever to Hebrew fir the unknown. I had a laugh.

I'm by no means an afficiando when it comes to either of these movies (usta know a fiar bit about starwars but got sick of it and forgot about it)BUT how could you possibly say that because Obi-wan dies and gandalf dies it's a semi blatant rip off?

Seems a bit potatoish to me.

Jan_Itor

Define potato...

SoulSprinner

Small, strangely shaped vegetable grown underground.

Anidazen

RIP OFF! The potaeto has been defined before, in the dictionary. Sue!



Lol seems this thread has been pretty derailed. So people think that, even though it's set in the same premise and has some pretty obvious links I should go ahead and do it, just remove it as far as possible from HP?

Ie. Digimon to Pokemon, Battlestar Galactica to Star Wars, etc etc.


- A nice piece, read with interest.

__________________
http://www.samsmith.co.uk - My attempts at light humour columns.

bobothegoat

In today's world, it seems nearly impossible to write something that doesn't get compared to things already in the market. If it's similar, that;s not nessesarily a bad thing. After all, each sequel is similair to it's predessor, if you include elements that people liked from the book it should be successful.

Obviously if your character is named Larry Potter, must learn his craft for seven years, and must always fight off a half-dead guy, well that might be excessive. Like everyone has been saying (for the most part...), if you use things that make it original, you should be okay.

__________________
Bobo the Goat