a bit of help needed... - Writers Forum

pyko · 12-28-2003, 06:22 AM

hello all

ok, most ppl here probably don't know, but i am currently in High School - and therefore I do english as a subject, and we study books and write storeis etc etc.

There are several things that I find very hard to do..and i was wondering if i could get some advice.

1. I find it VERY hard to write essays, stories, articles etc. - i would sit there, at my desk for hours on end staring at an empty piece of paper. And when i do finally get say, the first sentence down, after another long period of thinking i would rub it out as it seems wrong. sometimes I have the idea, but i just can't manage to put it down.
(note - this is not only for english essays/stories where the writing is the most important, but it also happens to me for other subjects - such as Chemistry, where i know that its really the content that matters)

2. I also find it hard to see symbolism in books...in fact i pretty much find it impossible. I can sometimes see/undrstand how the symbol works after the teacher points it out - but certainly not before.

those are the 2 main problems that i have...there are other little ones, but it would be greatly appreciated if i could get some advice as to how i can 'cure' these problems...

thank you!

Solaris · 12-28-2003, 03:46 PM

Your problem is you don't know enough information. You need to put a little more time into researching whatever it is you are writing on or learning about.

The most popular writing tool that you need to master is, writing allusions.

Here's the definition:

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=allusion

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One tv show you are probably really familiar with is The Simpsons. Every episode is filled with allusions. You couldn't possibly understand some episodes unless you had a general grasp of what they were alluding to. Or just like any show, a lot of the jokes are in reference to other episodes and unless you've seen those episodes, those jokes slip past you and you don't get the full enjoyment of what you are viewing.

That's all symbolism is. It's a reference to something else that only a few select people will understand. It's an allusion.

The thing is, your teachers know you won't know the answers to a lot of the questions on symbolism. Because the answers to symbolism aren't something you pull out of the air. It's not something you can magically figure out. You have to know what it's in reference to or what it correlates with.

You've probably watched the Simpsons before and never would have thought that Homer and Marge Simpson are based off of the previous works of Matt Groening's rabbit characters who had big eyes and long ears stretched above their heads. Perhaps that's why Marge has big hair, like rabbit ears?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0679...12#reader-link

It's something you aren't expected to know unless you want to know. You have to go looking for symbolism, and that's what your teachers are trying to get you to do.

pyko · 12-29-2003, 05:20 AM

more research...more information - i have actually never been suggested that - its always been read and write more - thanks for that!

but i have a feeling that that isn't all there is to my problem...because for example - my chemistry assignment - i had TONS of information, but i still couldn't start - nor write a good report (same with my IPT assignment)..it just seems that i'm always 'lost for words'.

and you also mentioned - "writing allusion" - to me, it seems pretty much the same as "writing symbolism" .. but how?

Solaris · 12-29-2003, 05:25 PM

Have you ever tried to write a screenplay in the exact format it's suppose to be in? If you were asked to write a screenplay and knew what to write, could you write one?

As for chemistry, you probably need an example...some sort of a framework. If you could just see a sample, you'd have no trouble at all. Maybe if you seen what an A+ paper looked like?

Here's what a screenplay looks like by the way, in the correct format.

http://www.movie-page.com/scripts/diehard.txt

Jollster · 12-29-2003, 05:33 PM

Maybe you just plan it so much when you get around to writing you want your writing to be, and expect it to be, perfect. So instead of just rolling with it - trusting yourself to write something good - you're scrutinizing every sentence... result being you never get anywhere.

I've got this problem and to be honest I haven't gotten through it yet. But then I'm really, really lazy. It might help if you just practice writing pieces, and actually finish them. Never mind what's in it so much. Set your standards lower - you might be surprised you end up exceeding them.

Chill. Writing ain't meant to wind you up.

Jollster · 12-29-2003, 05:39 PM

Oh, also, I heard this helps.

Write a really bad story. Porn is good for this. Wooden dialogue, lots of clichés, terrible plot line. It's a writer's block cure thing. Which sounds like what you've got. Might help.

pyko · 12-30-2003, 03:12 AM

mm...a screenplay - maybe, as long as I had an idea or I was basing it on something else. And the screenplay I would end up with would be much shorter.

If I did have the chance to look at an A+ essay, it give me some ideas, but I'm not sure how much it will help.

I have seen a friends english essay - A+ (top of the grade) - but I couldn't figure out why it was so good if you get me.

I have tried to not think too much about the sentence when I write - but its sooo hard!!! - I must try harder

thanks for all the suggestions - keep them coming

blackswan · 12-30-2003, 01:40 PM

Wait, so there's a blank piece of paper in front of you, and you have trouble starting it, doesn't matter what kind of writing it is.

Does the subject you're writing about interest you at all? Does this happen to you *all* the time or just sometimes? Because, really, if you hate the subject you're writing about, it's reasonable that you'll have trouble writing any thing good. And remeber it doesn't have to be perfect...

What grades do you get on your reports, may I ask? Just wondering...since some teachers, when they pass back the papers write comments and stuff on them and allow rewrites, like my english teacher...

-Laura

pyko · 12-31-2003, 02:08 AM

yep - blank piece of paper right in front of me.
mm...well, most of the time none of the subjects are very interesting...
English - all based on the books we study
Chemistry - Acid Rain, Gas Liquid Chromatography
IPT - Bill Gates

the grades i usually get is B+ (i know its not such a low grade - but i spend AGES on it and it really mucks up study time for other subjects)

the other things is, when i write orals i find it much easier - i know the structure is slightly different, but still, i find writing orals much easier - though i think that may have to do with that in primary (yr1 - 7) we hardly wrote any essays, only orals every 2 weeks or so.

oh, and one more thing. i'm not sure if this has anything to do with my writing blocks - but I am a very maths/science person...

pyko · 11-12-2004, 08:47 AM

just revisiting this post....coz i am having a major major mental block.

And this time its for writing Applications for Unis...Questions like:
-Tell us about yourself.
-What are the two biggest problems you have encountered and how did you overcome them?

and believe it or not....im stuck for words. I've tried just writing *anything*, but it ends up so bad that I have to delete it in the end....

does anyone have any more suggestions/ideas to cure this "block"?

ps. i just realised...i don't seem to have much problem posting on forums...never seem to be loss for words....?

mammamaia · 11-12-2004, 11:08 AM

hi, there, pyko!...

as it happens, i've helped quite a few folks with app essays and would be glad to give you a hand...

email me 'at home' and let's see what we can do, ok?

love and hugs, maia
maia3maia@hotmail.com

ps: the good news is your ps!... so, we're not dealing with a hopeless case here, are we?

playstation60 · 11-12-2004, 02:46 PM

Hey Pyko,

Welcome to the world of writing. Everyone has difficulties with writing at some point in time. The biggest thing to remember is to not give up. You've taken a step in the right direction by asking for help.

Symbolism is something that frustrates a lot of people. Think of it as a way of saying something without coming out and saying it. A good example is to listen to music. Take the song "The Red" by Chevelle for example. The song is about being so angry that your vision becomes red, to the point where it is all you can see.
Often times authors will use colors to show symbolism. They take the common association with a color and use it to convey an emotion, or whatever purpose they might need. Ie...Red = passion, love, anger, White = innocence, purity, virginity, etc...
Symbolism is fun, if you ask me. It just takes a little more thinking.

Hang in there.

Ben

Emma LB · 11-12-2004, 02:59 PM

The problem I have with working out the symbolism in some books is that the author never considered the fact that in a 100 years ppl would still be reading his book, or if he did he didn't care

. In many books you have the problem that the symbolism the author added was most likely evident to a reader of his time and place, but just isn't anymore.
Colours as Ben mentioned are of course symbols that do not change their symbolic meaning that often, but it does happen. Fontane has one of his main characters who lives in Prussia meet up with someone in front of a yellow and black house. So what? Unless you know a hell of a lot about history you just won't know that yellow and black were the colours of Austria and that Austria and Prussia were major enemies at the time and that this shows that she was about to do something very ‘un-Prussian’, but very Austrian.

That is one of the reason I'm not too fond to symbolism, as the author can't always expect his readers to know what he knows. It's better when authors used more general symbolism, but it depends which books you're reading. If you know what time period they are from then just search the net and read up on commonly used symbols of that time. If it's a modern novel and you don't see the symbolism then don't despair, a quick glance at the author's biography might help.

pyko · 11-19-2004, 11:12 PM

hi all - thanks for the suggestions!
and thanks mammamaia for ur offer for help but i've already sent it in (got some help from friends).

what i've realised, while writing the app - is that i say things in very few words...which looks 'bad' as i usually only end up with one/two sentences....

Not quite sure, but i think its a combination of I don't elaborate enough and also I don't really know what I want to say...and probably more importantly - I don't know HOW to say it.

Just wondering if anyone has any ideas as to how I can improve on general english writing...just sort of general everyday writing stuff - letters etc.

I just always seem to be stuck for words!

mammamaia · 11-20-2004, 09:59 AM

glad to hear you found help with that essay, pyko... the 3 best ways to improve one's writing are: read, read, READ!

by constantly reading the best examples of the kind of writing you want to do, you get a feel for what it looks like, what goes into it... keep stuffing your head with other people's words, and you'll find your own will start flowing out more easily...

hugs, maia