Poetry Tutorials - Writers Forum

Stewart · 11-01-2005, 05:49 AM

After wading through the poetry forum it has come to my attention that there are loads of people posting their half-baked thoughts and calling them poems. Most of them come in regularly lined stanzas but fail to contain any sort of rhythm or knowledge of metre.

There are those that may claim that free verse is a perfectly valid form of expression, and it is, but when you just throw words into tidy lines without really considering the weight a word carries it's not free verse; it's teenage girl diary rambling. If you want to write poetry then it's probably best that you learn form before going on to break the rules.

Would it be possible for a poetry guide to be stickied in the poetry forum explaining poetry terms such as iamb, trochee, enjambment, metre, etc and also a demonstration of several poetic forms (e.g. sonnet, sestina, ode, ballad) to show that poetry can be rewarding if properly wrought?

Ilan Bouchard · 11-01-2005, 06:30 AM

Connor,

When/If I have time, I shall attempt to compile a guide and add it to the Writing 101 sticky thread.
I can't claim I'll be done or start soon. Probably not during Nano month, for sure, so you're free to contribute to the creation of such a thread or post.

Stewart · 11-01-2005, 06:36 AM

I'll help contribute as and when I can. I'll just post scraps here for compilation.

mammamaia · 11-01-2005, 07:42 AM

i agree that most amateur 'poetry' is fit only for a locked and hidden-away diary, but when advising folks in your 'guide,' i hope you'll keep in mind that all good poetry does not conform to one standardized structure or another...

i'm a fairly full-time poet, and of the hundreds of poems i've written, i've never once tried to conform a piece to any 'traditional' format, though all are carefully crafted and have a purposeful structure...

Stewart · 11-01-2005, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammamaia

i'm a fairly full-time poet, and of the hundreds of poems i've written, i've never once tried to conform a piece to any 'traditional' format, though all are carefully crafted and have a purposeful structure...

If yours are carefully crafted and you know what you are doing then I doubt I could find fault in them. The fault would be my own for not understanding your intent; although the other outcomes could be not liking your presentation, liking your presentation, or finding a level of agreement.

Out of interest, why have you never written to an established form?

mammamaia · 11-01-2005, 08:24 AM

that's a good question, connor!

first of all, i'd read all the great poets' works from early childhood on... was reading the iliad and the odyssey by 9, along with nancy drew and a 'child's book of poems'... and all the poe and shakespeare i could get my hands on... noyes' 'highwayman' and coleridge's 'kubla khan' were then, and remain two of my favorites... so, when i started writing poetry decades later, i had all of those forms stashed away in my head, along with angelou's and langston hughes' and other more contemporary greats... it may be that some of my works do fit into one or another of the traditional forms, but if so, it wasn't 'on purpose,' as i sort of let my poems choose their own structure...

why i don't do it on purpose is that i have no need to prove that i can copy anyone else's style and, since i'm mainly a philosopher-poet, the message in the piece always takes precedence over and more or less dictates form... i'd never given any thought to why i write poetry without forcing it into an 'established' structure, so your question is appreciated, as it's given me a chance to think about it and solidify my comfort in how i write...

since you're clearly knowledgeable about the various poetic templates, i'd be interested in knowing whether any of my work does follow some traditional form... if you have some spare time and are willing to waste a bit of it, take a stroll through the 'philosetry' section of my site and let me know if you find anything traditional there... you've got me curious now!

love and hugs, maia

**Penelope** · 11-01-2005, 08:30 AM

I began writing poetry with rhyming couplets. Then I fell upon the online writers' sites and tripped over a villanelle. Then someone else suggested I try haiku. Yet another gave me a lead on triolets. I have worked my way through a myriad of poetic styles and find all of them a wonderful challenge (except sonnets). While most of what I post nowadays isn't a specific style, I still exercise my options but those are usually for publication markets. I firmly believe that until one becomes well versed (small pun) in the classics, the art of poetry can't be truly appreciated.

I have no formal education when it comes to writing so I can't get into the technical aspects but I do know which is what and can manage most of them.

Stewart · 11-01-2005, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammamaia

that's a good question, connor!

And I thank you for your answer.

Quote:

i'd be interested in knowing whether any of my work does follow some traditional form... if you have some spare time and are willing to waste a bit of it, take a stroll through the 'philosetry' section of my site and let me know if you find anything traditional there... you've got me curious now!

Time permitting, I'll have a look. I'm also taking part in the novel writing month in order to push myself, but I need a break every now and again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penelope

I began writing poetry with rhyming couplets. Then I fell upon the online writers' sites and tripped over a villanelle. Then someone else suggested I try haiku. Yet another gave me a lead on triolets. I have worked my way through a myriad of poetic styles and find all of them a wonderful challenge (except sonnets). While most of what I post nowadays isn't a specific style, I still exercise my options but those are usually for publication markets. I firmly believe that until one becomes well versed (small pun) in the classics, the art of poetry can't be truly appreciated.

Mmmm! Villanelles, haiku, sonnets, triolets.

The one that I like, although haven't achieved yet, is the sestina.

**Penelope** · 11-01-2005, 08:53 AM

ooo! I've done a few of those. Five in collaboration with another poet. My favourite of my own is Big Sky Winter. I thought I'd posted it here but if you like, I will.

Stewart · 11-01-2005, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penelope

My favourite of my own is Big Sky Winter. I thought I'd posted it here but if you like, I will.

Please do.

**Penelope** · 11-01-2005, 09:47 AM

You've got it. I find it odd that I never posted it here unless I took it down. Normally when I post a specific style of poem (except sonnets because they rarely make the grade) I will identify it in the title line.

Last year several of us had a wonderful time posting ABCDerian poems. What a hoot that was!

Stewart · 11-01-2005, 10:46 AM

Thanks. I've read it, but want to take some time to think about it. I know I have some questions and/or comments, but I'll post them to that thread.

**Penelope** · 11-01-2005, 11:13 AM

no problem either way. It was my second sestina.