Thread: Damn the World (language)

Dammit, dammit, damn the world!
Damn the world and all its hate,
All its cruelness,
All its pain.
I used to be a child.
I used to be a kid.
I used to have a life.
Then the world introduced itself.
And it beat me down and broke my heart.
It ripped the innocence from my body
It twisted children,
Polluted their minds.
Made them grow up to fast.
Damn this world that shuns.
That snuffs out any light.
That stuffs its people with temporary pleasure.
That robs the innocence of girls.
That grows monsters inside of men.
This sick, twisted, demented, horrible world.
That creates forced normalities.
That has drowned out hope.
And left a dark empty hole where it once was.
Dammit, dammit, damn the world!
Damn the world and all within it.

wrong crowd?

Needs work.

Originally Posted by shedpog329

wrong crowd?

. . .what?

Originally Posted by johnM

Needs work.

Agreed, but please be more specific or don't post.

Originally Posted by S.M. grimbldoo

Agreed, but please be more specific or don't post.

The reason I didn't elaborate is because of the strong impression I got that my time would be wasted. I am still getting that impression.

But here's a little of what I mean: the first five lines, just as an example, are so muddled in abstract language that they completely fail to interest me as a reader. There is no imagery, nothing specific. Hate, pain, cruelty -- these words have many thousands of specific manifestations. The power of writing is in specific details, calling attention to a specific moment in time.

Originally Posted by johnM

The reason I didn't elaborate is because of the strong impression I got that my time would be wasted. I am still getting that impression.

But here's a little of what I mean: the first five lines, just as an example, are so muddled in abstract language that they completely fail to interest me as a reader. There is no imagery, nothing specific. Hate, pain, cruelty -- these words have many thousands of specific manifestations. The power of writing is in specific details, calling attention to a specific moment in time.

...and, what else?

Originally Posted by johnM

The reason I didn't elaborate is because of the strong impression I got that my time would be wasted. I am still getting that impression.

But here's a little of what I mean: the first five lines, just as an example, are so muddled in abstract language that they completely fail to interest me as a reader. There is no imagery, nothing specific. Hate, pain, cruelty -- these words have many thousands of specific manifestations. The power of writing is in specific details, calling attention to a specific moment in time.

Your impression is correct only because you made it correct. I asked you to specify, you did not have to be rude about it. I agree that there is power in being specific but poetry isn't always specific, and as an effect, it is able to reach a wider group of people because the muddled words have multiple meanings that can be applied multiple ways.

Civility Gentlemen, please.

Grimbldoo, I think that the repeated words are a bit much here, they distract rather than add to the feeling. In other words, I find myself thinking, " there are a lot of damns here", instead of absorbing what you are actually saying. Which is a shame because the content is actually something most of us can agree with wholeheartedly.

Originally Posted by Gumby

Civility Gentlemen, please.

Grimbldoo, I think that the repeated words are a bit much here, they distract rather than add to the feeling. In other words, I find myself thinking, " there are a lot of damns here", instead of absorbing what you are actually saying. Which is a shame because the content is actually something most of us can agree with wholeheartedly.

Thank you Gumby. I agree, the word damn is used a lot, but the speaker, as you can see, is angry at the world. So I think to keep the whole emotion of the speaker the damns will have to stay.

p.s grimbldoo is lowercase

Sorry, love, but I agree with Cindy. You've some good bones here but they're buried beneath all those damns. The constant repetition is robbing them of their impact in my humble opinion, and as Cindy said, the reader is so overwhelmed, the good stuff is not sinking in as well as it could be. Your piece, your decision. Perhaps you would consider eliminating just a few to let the rest of your words shine, or select an additional word to express the extent of the anger to break up the repetition a bit.

Best,
Lisa

Originally Posted by Chester's Daughter

Sorry, love, but I agree with Cindy. You've some good bones here but they're buried beneath all those damns. The constant repetition is robbing them of their impact in my humble opinion, and as Cindy said, the reader is so overwhelmed, the good stuff is not sinking in as well as it could be. Your piece, your decision. Perhaps you would consider eliminating just a few to let the rest of your words shine, or select an additional word to express the extent of the anger to break up the repetition a bit.

Best,
Lisa

The more I come back to read this the more I agree with you and Gumby.

Vagueness doesn't let more people relate to it -- it makes it easier to brush off.

Specificity to the point that it feels real and we experience some specific tangible event is what makes something broadly relatable. Also, subtlety can help make the anger stronger.

In other words, compare what you have: "Dammit, dammit, damn the world! / Damn the world and all its hate, / All its cruelness, / All its pain."

with the opening panels of the graphic novel Watchmen. "Dog carcass in alley this morning, tire tread on burst stomach. This city is afraid of me. I have seen its true face. / The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. / The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout "Save us!" ... / ... and I'll look down and whisper "no.""

It has the exact same message as yours, but it gives us a little bit of a story, it gives us very specific (shocking) imagery, and it's got some (a little) subtlety to the way it presents the POV character's attitude. Same message, but I can feel it more viscerally from the graphic novel because of the added specificity and imagery. The imagery is shocking to the point that it makes me react emotionally. Also because it's been attached to a story.

Anyway, good start -- keep it up, maybe a little revising, and it'd get a better reaction.

Originally Posted by j.w.olson

Vagueness doesn't let more people relate to it -- it makes it easier to brush off.

Specificity to the point that it feels real and we experience some specific tangible event is what makes something broadly relatable. Also, subtlety can help make the anger stronger.

In other words, compare what you have: "Dammit, dammit, damn the world! / Damn the world and all its hate, / All its cruelness, / All its pain."

with the opening panels of the graphic novel Watchmen. "Dog carcass in alley this morning, tire tread on burst stomach. This city is afraid of me. I have seen its true face. / The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. / The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout "Save us!" ... / ... and I'll look down and whisper "no.""

It has the exact same message as yours, but it gives us a little bit of a story, it gives us very specific (shocking) imagery, and it's got some (a little) subtlety to the way it presents the POV character's attitude. Same message, but I can feel it more viscerally from the graphic novel because of the added specificity and imagery. The imagery is shocking to the point that it makes me react emotionally. Also because it's been attached to a story.

Anyway, good start -- keep it up, maybe a little revising, and it'd get a better reaction.

Actually those have different meanings, but the emotions are close. As I stated before, I agree with specific = stronger, but also as I said before poetry does not have to be specific and it tends not to. Your argument is valid but it does not belong here.

Originally Posted by S.M. grimbldoo

Actually those have different meanings, but the emotions are close. As I stated before, I agree with specific = stronger, but also as I said before poetry does not have to be specific and it tends not to. Your argument is valid but it does not belong here.

Ah, see, you misunderstand. I'm telling you that I did get the same message from the two. And I'm telling you that being specific is always better. I'm telling you that good poetry does tend to be specific -- newer and underdeveloped poets tend to write vaguely. You can disagree -- that's fine -- but telling people who've taken the time to read your poem, think about it, and offer constructive criticism that their effort "does not belong here" is really not the best way to go.

In other words, I didn't get much of a reaction from reading your poem as is. Assuming you want to cause a reaction in readers like me, specificity and strong imagery will make a difference. If you don't want readers like me to like it, keep turning away those giving advice.

Originally Posted by j.w.olson

Ah, see, you misunderstand. I'm telling you that I did get the same message from the two. And I'm telling you that being specific is always better. I'm telling you that good poetry does tend to be specific -- newer and underdeveloped poets tend to write vaguely. You can disagree -- that's fine -- but telling people who've taken the time to read your poem, think about it, and offer constructive criticism that their effort "does not belong here" is really not the best way to go.

In other words, I didn't get much of a reaction from reading your poem as is. Assuming you want to cause a reaction in readers like me, specificity and strong imagery will make a difference. If you don't want readers like me to like it, keep turning away those giving advice.

I did not intend to say that your argument was invalid, it isn't, it's just that these sort of debates don't really belong in this area. I can personally argue that I once read a song that related to what was happening in my life because it withheld detail that would have restrained it to a certain situation in the writers own life, but instead was very general, or vague. And please try not to get to personal because, you probably weren't even trying to be, I felt that your last sentence was a little rude.