Meter in poetry, Is it a must? - Writers Forum

PrisonerOfPrey · 04-06-2008, 10:35 AM

I was on a different forum the other day and I posted a poem, admittedly not my very best, but it wasn't crap. ("The Third Generation") The only comment I received was a carbon copy post about how I need to learn meter and know what forced rhyme is. (Which I do know, and my poem didn't have)

Admittedly I don't use a certain meter in my writing (being 15, I haven't the time to study it) however, these people told me repeatedly that poetry is crap without it, (before they deleted my post.)

So do people here agree? Is meter the one most important thing in writing?

Me13 · 04-06-2008, 04:33 PM

I don't really have anything technical to add because to be honest I can't identify meter. I thought I'd mention that a lot of time when I'm writing the meter tends to establish itself. I don't like to force it but it does give a poem a nice easy flow when you read it and can act to drive it along...

PrisonerOfPrey · 04-06-2008, 04:57 PM

I know what meter is, I just don't actively use it when I write. I don't really think bout it so much. My questions was whether using specific meter (iambic pentameter, etc.) is essential.

rcallaci · 04-06-2008, 04:59 PM

The importance of Poetic Meter.

Poetic Meter is about beat, pace, flow. It’s the basic rhythmic structure of verse. Many traditional or structured verse forms require a specific verse meter or a certain set of meters alternating in a specific order. In free verse this order may be mixed creating a unique rhythm to the requirements of that poem. It’s all about stressed and unstressed syllables and where they are placed.

ba/Boom ba/Boom/ ba/Boom ba/Boom ba/Boom (iambic)
2 syllable count soft/hard

Boom/ba Boom/ba Boom/ba Boom/ba Boom/ba (trochaic)
2 syllable count hard/soft

Boom/Boom Boom/Boom Boom/Boom (spondaic)
2 syllable count hard/hard

ba/ba/Boom ba/ba/Boom ba/ba/Boom (anapestic)
3 syllable count soft/soft/hard

Boom/ba/ba Boom/ba/ba Boom/ba/ba (dactylic)
3 syllable count hard/soft/soft

Now lets mix it up;

ba/ba/Boom- ba/ba Boom- Boom/ba /ba- ba/boom

Meter is essential to poetry and understanding Metric rules is crucial to writing good poetry.

Think of Poetic meter as Musical notation

My warmest
bob

Ilasir Maroa · 04-06-2008, 05:00 PM

"Meter" as in regular(formal) meter is nothing important. Personally, I have extreme trouble identifying exactly what meter something is in. I know the structure of the meters, but you could say I'm "meter deaf". I have to play it by ear.

But the way a piece is written always involves informal meter, by which I mean not a "Meter" like "iambic tetrameter", but just how the sounds go together.

"I hate to make you wait,
But the storm will not abate.
I'm going on a date
With a lovely girl named Kate."

That's what I see as forced rhyme. Why would any sensible person use the word "abate" instead of "stop"? It's clearly forced in there, even if it fits the meter(or at least the syllable count).

"On the day of storms
When the one is born
And the veil is torn away."

Now that doesn't really have a "regular" meter, but it doesn't flow as badly as the first.

rcallaci · 04-06-2008, 05:05 PM

Prey

Got a little messed up in the order- had a do a rewrite.

When following a poetic format or structure that calls for Iambic pentameter and you use a different format or don't follow the rhymthic structure - use two many syllablles, wrong placement, overuse of words which messes with the rhythm than the poem will fail.

If your free forming you still have to follow metric guidelines and worry about the structure you are using-when you mix it up.

my warmest
bob

PrisonerOfPrey · 04-06-2008, 05:35 PM

I think perhaps I am confused. I would like to ask you (although you certainly don't have to) to read my poem "The Third Generation" and tell me how it has failed. Or how I did inadvertently use meter. I try and achieve flow and rhythm in my work, but everyone on the other board said it was useless. Please, I'm trying very hard to understand.

Thank you,
PrisonerofPrey

Shawn · 04-06-2008, 05:46 PM

Iambic pentameter is a form.

The iamb is the meter.

It's an easy confusion. It's nothing about constricting your writing, just making it sound better.

dannyboy · 04-09-2008, 06:07 AM

I prefer flow to meter
cadence to rhyme
and a damn good image to the lot of 'em

Danielle · 04-09-2008, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcallaci

The importance of Poetic Meter.

Poetic Meter is about beat, pace, flow. It’s the basic rhythmic structure of verse. Many traditional or structured verse forms require a specific verse meter or a certain set of meters alternating in a specific order. In free verse this order may be mixed creating a unique rhythm to the requirements of that poem. It’s all about stressed and unstressed syllables and where they are placed.

ba/Boom ba/Boom/ ba/Boom ba/Boom ba/Boom (iambic)
2 syllable count soft/hard

Boom/ba Boom/ba Boom/ba Boom/ba Boom/ba (trochaic)
2 syllable count hard/soft

Boom/Boom Boom/Boom Boom/Boom (spondaic)
2 syllable count hard/hard

ba/ba/Boom ba/ba/Boom ba/ba/Boom (anapestic)
3 syllable count soft/soft/hard

Boom/ba/ba Boom/ba/ba Boom/ba/ba (dactylic)
3 syllable count hard/soft/soft

Now lets mix it up;

ba/ba/Boom- ba/ba Boom- Boom/ba /ba- ba/boom

Meter is essential to poetry and understanding Metric rules is crucial to writing good poetry.

Think of Poetic meter as Musical notation

My warmest
bob

Very informative post. I think that meter can come into a poem organically and this is interesting because it shows you different types of meter. But poetry can still exist without it. There is nothing wrong with being wayward.

ShabookiSkittles · 04-14-2008, 08:23 AM

In my opinion, as far as poetry is concerned, ANYTHING goes. As long as you have expressed your ideas completely and gracefully a poem has potential for greatness. Tell them forumers that they need to stop living in England a couple hundred years ago and join us in the present, where people can think out of the box. Raaaaarrrgh!!! We are the future!

Garden of Kadesh · 05-29-2008, 08:42 PM

I feel your pain Ilasir. I have a difficult time differentiating stressed vs. unstressed syllables. I've been experimenting with meter in my writing lately, but I think I fail.

The FLOWers are a PREtty PURple hue,
it is unFOR-TUN-ate they SMELL like glue.

Did I highlight the stressed syllables correctly here? (Sorry about that couplet)

lin · 05-29-2008, 08:46 PM

No, Shawn. Actually, pentameter is a meter, an iamb is a "foot" a sonnet is a "form"

There is no real requirement for a poem to have meter, form or rhyme.

Ilasir Maroa · 05-29-2008, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garden of Kadesh

I feel your pain Ilasir. I have a difficult time differentiating stressed vs. unstressed syllables. I've been experimenting with meter in my writing lately, but I think I fail.

The FLOWers are a PREtty PURple hue,
it is unFOR-TUN-ate they SMELL like glue.

Did I highlight the stressed syllables correctly here? (Sorry about that couplet)

I don't think so.

The FLOWers ARE a PREtty PURple HUE,
It IS unFORtunATE they SMELL like GLUE.

Since meter and true stress aren't quite equal, meter is tough. These lines are scanned for me as iambic pentameter. "glue" and "hue" being at the end of the lines, and preceding a period or semi-colon(not a comma as you have put) in normal speech recieve extra stress. "Flow-" having a dipthong, the o and the w-glide, has more relative stress than "-ers" or "the" recieves the stress in the line. The same with "are" and "is".

Note that in meter, inherent lexical stress or stress as heard in prose does not always apply, and stress is rounded in poetry relative to surrounding syllables, where there are many levels in normal speech. I may not have been as correct on the second line.

Shawn · 05-29-2008, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lin

No, Shawn. Actually, pentameter is a meter, an iamb is a "foot" a sonnet is a "form"

There is no real requirement for a poem to have meter, form or rhyme.

Metrical block... same difference.

I'm pretty sure I meant to say meter for pentameter. 'Twas a while ago.