Hodge

Yeah, repression of anything, really, leads to all manner of psychological disorders later in life. In fact, it can actually lead to physical problems as well (repression of emotions can lead to heart attacks, ulcers, high blood pressure, etc.).

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Science

Rico

Haha, Hodge, say it loud and say it proud!!!


sorry...gay pride just infected me for a second...

valeca

Personally, I thought the piece was exceedingly well written.

Arrogance wrapped in ignorance, swimming in blind faith, clinging to the social trends of a ruling class.


Vive le Canada!

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"...make your own nature, not the advice of others, your guide in life." --Pythia, Oracle of Apollo at Delphi

I'm here.

Dooga Aetrus Blackrazor

Christianity is often synonymous with ignorance. After all, you rarely see Atheists defending such things as banning gay marriages and abortions, keeping women from being priests, preventing assisted suicide, and stopping stem cell research.

The moral progression of society of often hampered by the ignorance of religion. You can't blame people for getting annoyed once in awhile. Some people disagree with Christianity.

Vegetarians disagree with eating meat. It's unreasonable to ask them to respect your choices if you respect theirs. After all, their belief is that your belief is wrong. As a vegetarian and rabid atheist, I see strong similiarities between the two issues of morality.

However, you don't hear me refusing to listen. Sure, I don't respect certain views, but I'm usually willing to listen to someone else explain their opinions. What's wrong with that?

PaPa

When talking about death by hanging it is definitely hanged, not hung.

Moving on, most of the points in Kane's posts have already been ably refuted by others, but I would point out a few things...

- Procreation is not the only purpose of marriage. Marriage is a statement of your love for another person and your intent to remain with them for the rest of your life, and I see no reason why homosexuals should not be allowed to make this statement if they wish.

- The "nature" argument is nonsense. Homosexuality is one of the most natural things that humans do in the modern world, and don't give me that guff about using your body parts properly e.g. you're not supposed to inhale the smoke of burning plants into your lungs either, but many still do.

- Stop saying that you don't have anything against homosexuals and then go on about how wrong it is.

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+1

horrorcrafter

today I hang.

yesterday I hung.

Horrorcrafter

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Canadian Lynx are beautiful sensitive creatures which are very good mothers and they make a wide variety of sounds such as meows, purrs, cough-barks, growls, and screams like a woman. She is the next mammal to become extinct in North America largely because we waste so much paper. Please reduce, reuse, and recycle. Cheers, Horrorcrafter

bobothegoat

I hate the term, "open-minded." It's a cliche. Everyone says they're open-minded. If I hear one more person say, "I'm open-minded," I think I'll puke. Or scream. Or perhaps both.

Anyway, I thought the the essay was well-written. No complaints from me. Not surprisingly, this is another respectable essay supporting gay-rights. I cannot think of any like this against gay-rights.

From my standpoint, there are only two arguments agianst gay-rights. The first has been covered: a "naturalness" of homosexuality. PaPa's example of smoking is an example. What about the mere fact that I'm typing on this keyboard? Surely my fingers were not created to type on a keyboard. I must be sacreligious...

The second argument I hear made tends to be along the lines of maintaining the sanctity of marriage and God's word, etc. etc.

Right... Does anyone realize that that very same arguement was used to deny interracial marriages? I'll grant that the line has to be drawn somewhere, or we might get people marrying their cats or practicing polygomy. However, gay marriage is not the spot for such a line. Too large of a chunk of our population.

I'm not sure what the statistic is on gays, but someone said something along the lines of 10%. Odd... If that's true, we've got about the same percent of Blacks in our population (and these populations aren't mutually exclusive, by the way). If Black rights are important (and they are), then Gay-rights should be too.

Anyway, that's my take on it...

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Bobo the Goat

Rico

heh, bobo, I posted it earlier.

Hodge

Two arguments, one is completely invalid and the other is completely subjective. Game over.

Kane

I never said procreation was the only purpose of marriage. Murder, strong-arming, disease, poison, rape... these are all things found in the natural animal world. Should we indulge in those as well? or just what YOU consider to be ok? I don't believe homosexuality is natural, but a condition of the mind. Does this mean I have to bash gay people? No, I don't need to hate people just because I disagree with what they do or say. This is the only 'gay' thread I've ever participated in, and since the subject is homosexuality, I am stating my opinion on the matter. As for people refuting most of what I've said: as in other posts, they have stated opinion contradictory to my own or studies and evidence to suggest another possible result, not refuted me. And by the way, there is no point to state a thesis that can't be argued against.

You keep latching on to my testes and acting as though you've won some great victory, but you haven't said anything mind blowing, original or in many cases even relevant. Most of your posts are specifically to me, like you are in some personal battle with me, but dude, get off it. It's old and retarded. Go write a story or something... but don't pat yourself on the back for doing jack shit. I hate to become abrasive but you are acting like a little twerp.

There are many peopel on this board, though for the most part you all agree on many issues. I happen to disagree with many and end up taking a lot of flack for it. But you keep mistaking your opinion for fact and it's becoming quite annoying. If all of the things you have claimed as fact were actually fact, this world would be a different place than it already is. You wouldnt have to argue with me on a internet forum because the stuff would be common knowledge.

Hodge

That is completely wrong, though, as a homosexual's brain is physically different from a straight person's. Were it a condition of the mind (and only the mind), there would have to be something in common with all homosexuals (like they were raised in gay households), and this is not the case. Homosexuality is found in the same percentages within all societies.

Also note that homosexuality does occur in the wild.

http://www.bidstrup.com/sodomy.htm

That's not entirely true. Just off the top of my head because I was thinking about this earlier, it's "common knowledge" that urine is unsanitary. But it's really not, because urine is mostly ammonia, which kills bacteria and viruses. It's "common knowledge" that there are millions of little bacteria living on our hands. It's also a common assumption that we need to kill these bacteria, but the opposite is true because we live in a state of symbiosis with them (they eat nutrients off of our skin which keeps harmful bacteria from proliferating; they also keep our immune systems exercised).

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valeca

See, this is what I meant in the other post. Great arguement, facts to back it up..no condescention..bravo! (I still think you were as ass in the other one )

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"...make your own nature, not the advice of others, your guide in life." --Pythia, Oracle of Apollo at Delphi

I'm here.

Kane

You're playing semantics with me Hodge, but whatever. I have no doubt that homosexuality occurs in the wild. So does masturbation. That is why I pointed out that many other things occur in the wild, natural world. nevertheless, these things are not tolerated in society. So I don't really see how that point is really relevant to the conversation.


The difference between homosexuality and the examples you brought up is that the issue of homosexuality is a big one. If it could be proven as fact, that homosexuality is a DNA thing then you can bet it would be all over the news and talk show ring. There would be no grounds for debate on the whole gay marriage issue. It wouldn't even be in political contention if it was proven that it was a DNA thing.

Hodge

That's because it's not genetic, it's physiological. I already described how it happens earlier in this thread (hormones). Although studies have shown that biological children of gay parents are more likely to be gay themselves, so the cause of the hormonal imbalances before birth probably are genetic.

And the point is that neither are "wrong" for any reason other than because a religious figure says so. Social scientists are now being led to believe that homosexuality is functional in a society, and we already know that masturbation is (for men it keeps sperm fresh, new, and healthy, and for women it keeps her cervix in shape or something).

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valeca

Kane, you really need to check facts here. Masturbation is not only tolerated by western societies, many places will teach it is best to know your self before you can express adequetly to your partner what works for you. I highly doubt you've never indulged...and if you equate masturbation as wrong, just as you count homosexuality as wrong..wouldn't that make you hypocrytical?

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"...make your own nature, not the advice of others, your guide in life." --Pythia, Oracle of Apollo at Delphi

I'm here.