Outlaws: Life and Literature - Writers Forum

Writ-with-Hand · 10-09-2008, 01:09 AM

Is there still a place in modern literature for the outlaw?

Is there any virtue or true romance to the outlaw in real life?

Does your national culture hold the outlaw in a romantic regard?

Does the United States under appreciate or over appreciate the outlaw?

1. YouTube - Young Guns Dead or Alive

2. YouTube - Young Guns - Blaze of glory

Mike C · 10-09-2008, 03:26 AM

Yes - everyone loves an underdog and a rogue.

Little or none.

Not as much as US culture, I suspect. We have Dick Turpin and Robin Hood...

Over. You all dream of being cowboys and gunslingers.

spider8 · 10-09-2008, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Writ-with-Hand

Is there still a place in modern literature for the outlaw?

Of course.

Is there any virtue or true romance to the outlaw in real life?

Rarely, but sometimes. If the outlaw has been dealt a truly crap hand in life and crime's his only chance.

Does your national culture hold the outlaw in a romantic regard?

A lot of young people are attracted or intrigued and we see reflections of this in the way they dress and behave.

Does the United States under appreciate or over appreciate the outlaw?

I would not have thought it apreciates the real outlaw at all.

1. YouTube - Young Guns Dead or Alive

2. YouTube - Young Guns - Blaze of glory

Writ-with-Hand · 10-09-2008, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Does the United States under appreciate or over appreciate the outlaw?

I would not have thought it apreciates the real outlaw at all.

3. YouTube - AMERICAN GANGSTER- Full Trailer

Mike, something came to my mind this morning. I'm not trying to offend you because I know you have an experience in Northern Ireland, but let me pose this question.

Is it possible that in the 21st century bombs or explosives are more important for the outlaw than six shooters or semiautomatics?

The American Cowboy (originally Mexicans and Blacks by the way) really existed in its prime in the 1800s. And to my understanding most, or at least many, of the outlaw cowboys were former Confederate soldiers or rebel fighters.

Now, looking at the mid 20th century, it would seem associations like the IRA, PLO, Hezbollha and the 21st century Al-Qaida has shown us a new way: Bombing.

Maybe I ought to add in the American La Cosa Nostra and the Sicilian mafia because they did a lot of car bombings in their primes too.

Also... is it possible spreading disease through water, air, or other means via chemical and biological warfare replaces the sic shooter or even assault rifle in importance for the outlaw?

If I was in charge of Al-Qaida in the West I would seek alliances with non-Muslims, regroup, disband attacks on territories (nations) outside the U.S. with the agreement these leaderships cut off and isolate the U.S., recruit Latin Americans (whether they are Catholic or secular or even Protestant) and Carribean men. I would allow these hard chargers to rob banks and embrace a code that prays for their own torture with no mercy. Let them drink, party, be promiscuos. Basically have fun in a short life and die in a blaze of glory, or die cruellly from being raped with poles wrapped in barbed wire.

I would give them the Young Guns sound track as their song and identity.

flashgordon · 10-09-2008, 11:56 AM

Is there still a place in modern literature for the outlaw? You bet, we are waiting for one right now to guide us out of the mess modern society is currently in.

Is there any virtue or true romance to the outlaw in real life? Again, yes.

Does your national culture hold the outlaw in a romantic regard? In the US, everyone loves the outlaw as long as they are sticking it to the man.

Does the United States under appreciate or over appreciate the outlaw? Neither, the US is ambivalent until it becomes too big of an issue that the outlaw must be dealt with.

seigfried007 · 10-09-2008, 12:24 PM

Yes
Yes
Yes
Over.

"Outlaw" is too broad, but even so crime and law are topics everyone is passionate about.

The Christians who hid Jews in their attics and cellars were outlaws. American revolutionaries were all outlaws (same goes for many of the European settlers on Australia). Most revolutionaries are outlaws. Many who fight what they consider injustice are or become outlaws, therefore, there can be virtue in being an outlaw (and hence, a place in modern literature).

When I say the US over-appreciates the outlaw, I mean that it not only romanticizes righteous revolutionaries and those who fight oppression but also those who oppress (The Godfather and Hannibal Lecter, for instance). The air time devoted to outlaws alone speaks for their importance in our entertainment and news. Everything's about ratings and numbers of viewers so, thus, crime sells (Oz, Dexter).

Writ-with-Hand · 10-11-2008, 10:56 PM

To bad I wasn't born in the "Indian Territory" of what is now Oklahoma back in the latter 1800s.

Good pussy, good whiskey, good gun laws, good sun rises and sets... more free then than today.

AA · 10-11-2008, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike C

Over. You all dream of being cowboys and gunslingers.

Hahahahaha. No. Not me. I live in Texas, I have a lot of farming cowboy family and they disgust me. I think you'd find that to be a pretty popular sentiment.

Katastrof · 10-11-2008, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashgordon

Does your national culture hold the outlaw in a romantic regard? In the US, everyone loves the outlaw as long as they are sticking it to the man.

Umm...intentional irony?

Writ-with-Hand · 10-11-2008, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AA

Hahahahaha. No. Not me. I live in Texas, I have a lot of farming cowboy family and they disgust me. I think you'd find that to be a pretty popular sentiment.

In all seriousness... you know some people in Arizona legally walk around with pistols holstered to their waist?

AA · 10-12-2008, 12:31 AM

Yes. I know many people who carry guns. I was responding to the claim that "you all dream of being cowboys and gunslingers", maybe he was being satirical, if not, it was a gross exaggeration and that was the point I was trying to make without having to point the finger and say "that was a gross exaggeration".

lin · 10-12-2008, 01:58 AM

Being an "outlaw" in unincorporated territory is meaningless, like being a transvestite in Taliban country.

You can't be an outlaw unless there is a for you to be on the outs with. I've spent a lot of time in culture that idolizes outlawdom. I've met a handful of people who could have been heros back in gunslinger or pirate days. Today, they live marginal lives or are in prison.

We are calling Senators and Governors "mavericks" these days.

I admire people who cut adrift from their own culture in order to pursue their own vision. Nerds. AA members in Mexico. Gadgeteers.