^ The video I meant to go along with my last paragraph above.
I could not edit my post by attaching this video without - for some reason when I hit preview - bunching my entire post up into one long paragraph block. That would have made my post extremely difficult to read. So, I post this video in its own post instead. But it's meant to go along with my last paragraph in the post preceeding this one.
Peace.
Crimes happen outside of prison, regardless of how perfect and just a world you would like it to be. Should we turn a blind eye to those as well? Why is vigilante justice acceptable because it's happening in an institution, performed by people who've already proven they do not operate within the laws of society? Do you think a serial murderer is the appropriate person to determine who lives and dies in prison?Originally Posted by KyleColorado
So, if I understand you right, our mistake was that we should have raped and tortured the families of the judges developing the sentencing guidlines for rapists, because they weren't in the right frame of mind when they were deliberating? Perhaps you're suggesting that the victims of crimes, or their surviving family members, should be given first opportunity to pass judgment and sentence? Clearly we'll have a fair and unbiased legal system then.
You shouldn't be advocating for jailyard justice, but tougher laws and mandatory sentencing. Heck, you could even argue for the death penalty for pedophiles and serial rapists. The key is, whatever justice is delivered should be done solely by the justice system, and by an impartial party. Leaving it up to vigilantes and emotionally-charged victims will not create a stable and just society.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go smash my neighbour's windows because I know he steals cable, and nobody seems to want to do anything about it.
"Laugh and the world laughs with you, snore and you sleep alone."
- Anthony Burgess (1917-1994)
Well... it's stories like this that break my heart and make it extremely difficult not want bodily and psychological harm done to the vicious man that perpetrated this. I almost can't read the news any longer after reading stories like this. I feel despair.
Somehow... it feels to me like we all failed this child in some manner. My heart goes out to her mother, siblings, and relatives. Eternal rest.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/06/jorelys-rivera_n_1132110.html?1323197424&icid=maing-grid7|maing11|dl1|sec1_lnk2|118018
I said I'm okay with malicious, violent offenders being mistreated in prison, especially considering their history of mistreating others. What part of that made you conclude that I was saying "the family members of judges and jurors should be raped and tortured"? Either you're deliberately misconstruing my stance to the point of absurdity, or your reading comprehension is atrocious. Given the intelligent manner in which you speak, I'm assuming it's the former, so I don't care to answer this question.
I agree with you that this would make for a very poor legal system indeed. But I was not suggesting that victims, or their family members, be allowed to determing judgment and sentencing. I was simply admitting that, had I been a victim, or the family member of a victim, to an atrocious crime at the hands of an offender without remorse, I would want him to experience some personal suffering during his time in prison, so he could know first-hand the type of pain he has caused.
I can't disagree with you here. Well said.
All joking aside, I agree with the overall argument you're presenting, about the proper structure of the legal system and how it should be respected and employed. But I'm curious, do you think the parents of the victims of Sandusky's alleged repeated rapes and molestations are justified in wanting him to suffer? Or would you say that, in wanting so, they also, as you told me, "do not respect the law"?
Take an outraged mother and father, expressing their wishes for Sandusky to suffer... Would you walk up to them and lecture them on their hypocrisy?
Last edited by KyleColorado; 12-07-2011 at 02:24 AM.
If you only read the books that everyone else is reading, you can only think what everyone else is thinking.
- Haruki Murakami
Stoning is absolutely horrific. I didn't see the video, but I've seen and read about the punishment/execution practice before and it both saddens and infuriates me. An instance I heard about was the stoning of a woman whose husband knowingly and falsely accused her adultry, and she was wrapped in a sack and stoned to death by a crowd, including small children who threw rocks also, as they didn't know any better and thought it was a game.
If you only read the books that everyone else is reading, you can only think what everyone else is thinking.
- Haruki Murakami
Ewwwww!
“And now I’m looking at you,” he said, “and you’re asking me if I still want you, as if I could stop loving you. As if I would want to give up the thing that makes me stronger than anything else ever has. I never dared give much of myself to anyone before – bits of myself to the Lightwoods, to Isabelle and Alec, but it took years to do it – but, Clary, since the first time I saw you, I have belonged to you completely. I still do. If you want me.” ― City of Glass by Cassandra Clare.
Well if we're putting all jokes aside, my post will be half as long:
I don't think it would be hypocritical for them to want him to suffer, quite the opposite. I think as humans we tend to lash out at those that hurt us, and wish ill upon those who have done us wrong; this especially holds true for those that have wronged us in deeply personal, permanent ways. That's exactly why I advocate for a strong justice system, with penalties that provide a sense of justice and a strong state to enforce them in an impartial and uniform matter.
If we leave it to those that are emotionally invested or morally suspect (covering parents and convicts) we open ourselves to an unfair dispensation of justice. Ask a parent what they think a suitable punishment for the rape of their child is, and many won't be able to answer, because anything that would seem anywhere remotely adequate would call for a suspension of their morals. Criminals have a slightly easier hill to climb in that category, particularly lifers, and so they can't be trusted either.
How much is a rape worth? Who knows. Sometimes you have to look at it from the sense of establishing a good deterrant to others, and a long enough incarceration to limit reoffending opportunities.
But, all that aside, when the cards are on the table the victims, families, friends and even the criminals have to ask what they'll let these rapists take from them. They've already lost peace, some their trust, will they let them take away their morality as well?
Be good, do good, and healing can begin. Hate, stain your soul by lashing out, and you never leave that moment.
"Laugh and the world laughs with you, snore and you sleep alone."
- Anthony Burgess (1917-1994)
No argument from me here. Nice post, Capulet.
If you only read the books that everyone else is reading, you can only think what everyone else is thinking.
- Haruki Murakami
"Laugh and the world laughs with you, snore and you sleep alone."
- Anthony Burgess (1917-1994)
Most modern systems of justice exist to take the emotion out of the punishment process, not to provide an outlet for pain and desire for retribution. The sentences handed out by our courts were never designed to provide vengeance, only justice. But that's where the problem arises, isn't it? Getting a good grip on what justice means can be a lot like wrestling an eel; it's slick, it moves around a lot, and it can come back to bite you.
One Australian would respond, "Bloody hell!" right now. He wishes he stayed put in the land of kangaroos drinking his Fosters.
His back is probably not going to be the last thing injured. I'm placing bets that after leaving Saudi prison for his crime his butt will be hurting for a year.
Australian sentenced to 500 lashes in Saudi Arabia - Yahoo! News
Hence the qualifier 'modern'.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
1Likes
LinkBack URL
About LinkBacks
Reply With Quote