Thread: Are people inherently good?

There is a lot of evil in this world. Just flip on the news and the majority of what you will see will depress you. Suicide bombers and mothers killing their babies are now all-too-common stories that have lost a lot of their shock value. A new scam seems to be born every day that will take an elderly person for all they've got, corporations are now raking in record profits while their employees' standard of living continues to suffer, priests molest children, husbands and wives kill each other for insurance money.... I could go on and on. The news seems to be 90 percent negative -- full of atrocious acts commmited by greedy evil people.


My wife and I have been too trusting of people a number of times in the past and paid the price for it. We've been lied to, ripped off, not paid back... you name it. There are so many people that come across as sincere but have underlying agendas.

But admist all this evil, I still believe that people as a whole are inherently good. I believe there are more people out there that would be willing to give someone the shirt off their back, rather than take advantage of them.

Do you believe that good people outnumber the bad, or vice versa?

Where I come from--the good people far out weigh the bad---it's just that the bad gets sensationalized ...Headlines thrive on a new horror to report every day.It does not make for exciting press to report about the every day heroes...I have been at the mercy of strangers and have been met with gracious kindness...Peace...Jul

The mob is evil, stupid and simple.

Individuals are the same, just duplicitous when it suits. Good when it serves some selfish end. Bad when they try to be more than they really are. Just animals.

Course, I'm in a mood tonight.

My opinion is not so much good people outweighs the bad, or vice versa. Rather, given an opportunity to do wrong (cheat, lie, steal etc), more people are likely to yield to it.

That said, I feel that society can do more to promote honesty, honor, integrity, sacrifice and sharing, especially in the media. There's just too much violent in movies today.

Entropy is the natural state of the universe. Energy is lost. Things fall apart. The human soul is no different.

In our default condition, with no external controls, mankind degrades into an animal-like state of cruel barbarity. Only worse. Unlike animals, man can increase his evil, honing it to a sharp and all too efficient edge.

This is why a series of social controls are needed in any functioning society. From simple peer pressure, to organized religion, to complex laws governing behavior. Mankind has created these controls not because we like them, but history has proven we need them.

Work to bring out the good in your fellow man, and yourself. Simply assuming good will happen ensures evil will prevail.

At 71, and having traveled over a good bit of the planet in an occupation that required close observation of how people behave, I have to say that the number of inherently good people I've met is far, far, far greater than the number of inherently bad people. Unfortunately the actions of good people sometimes are bad given circumstances of war, poverty, or bigotry. In the face of all I've seen I must come down on the side of those who hold out hope that one day the people of Earth will learn to live together in peace and shared prosperity.

No, they won't, not while ever acquisitiveness in return for payment controls everything we do. The only hope we have is for that compensation desire to be turned off.

Well everyone stands to gain something from some thing but it does not mean that his intentions are bad. In fact there a lot of.... okay not a lot of but some people that I have met that have helped me even though they stood nothing to gain. I had a person drop me off to the office even though all I did was ask for directions. Some people are in fact good but I would not say that a lot of people are.

The problem with the whole good/bad debate is that no-one ever perceives themselves to be a bad person. People who do bad things can always find ways to justify their actions. Inside many a scam artist, mugger or abuser, you'll find a person who believes that society owes them something for a rotten childhood. Or else they delude themselves - by whatever twist of logic is necessary - into believing that what they are doing is good, or for the greater good. Hitler is generally considered to be the most evil man in history, yet he believed that he was acting for the good of society.

As a foster carer, I have experience of otherwise good children doing bad things as an act of revenge for something done to them. Then of course you have the act of doing something bad because getting attention for a bad thing, and being shouted at, is better than being ignored. I also have experience of children who suffer from low self-esteem and low confidence because they think they are bad people. They will go out of their way to do good deeds and prove that they are not bad.

And yes, I have a selfish reason for being a foster carer. That being that I will make a better parental figure for other children than my absent father was for me.

We all have our own motivations and reasons for doing both good and bad things, and we often want something back. I have little tolerance for religious sanctimoniousness, as many religious people only do good because they want a place in heaven.

Here is an interesting question. Do people do good things only because they want to be seen as a good person?

"Stupid is as stupid does".

Mr Gump here has a good idea. We're defined by our actions, and good/bad is no exception. However, it does seem like this world is constantly falling apart (though the shards never seem to drop...) and every news article related to murder, rape, hooliganism (and many more atrocities) do make us lose faith in the collective brotherhood of humanity. If a colleague agrees to help you with your work, you'll see it as a social good and be friendly with him/her, but you might not remember in time. What always seems to stick in our memory is, say, if that same colleague takes credit for your work. We could take that anger to the grave if we dwell on it.

Good actions are equal to bad actions, and usually good actions outweigh the evil in the world, but we usually forget these little acts of kindness while the terrors of humanity are carved into our memories by shock, awe, and a lot of the media (I always worry that I'm offending you when I slate the media, garza. Please don't take it personally, but some of my local newspapers continue to astound me with biased stupidity. I'm basing a lot of my opinion on the media from these papers).

No, they won't, not while ever acquisitiveness in return for payment controls everything we do. The only hope we have is for that compensation desire to be turned off.

Ox,
If I am able to do something good for someone out of kindness while expecting nothing in return, it makes me feel good inside. I'm not thinking about the favor being returned, others noticing my act of kindness or even going to heaven. It just feels good to help people. This is my "payment" and "compensation desire", and I have no desire for it to be "turned off." I don't believe that I'm even remotely unique in feeling this way. I believe that I am in the majority.

I think people are inherently good, but their definition of good might not fit yours. Someone may consider themselves a good person, leaving the abortion clinic to rest up before they donate their time at the food bank, but to someone else they're a murderer.

The man with four wives might think he's a great husband and father to his 12 kids, but to someone else they're a dirty bigamist.

The list goes on and on.

There are some clear examples of "bad" most people would share, including surrounding murder and stealing, so as far as that goes I think most people would rather not be murdered, and not be stolen from. The vast majority of people do not participate or fall victim to these types of behaviours, but we're all affected by them because they are reported heavily in the media. You hear far more examples of anti-social behaviour than you do positive.

So, executive summary, I think mankind is generally socialized to be positive members of their societies, but that perception will ever be skewed by our focus on highlighting the negative.

Originally Posted by Brock

Ox,
If I am able to do something good for someone out of kindness while expecting nothing in return, it makes me feel good inside. I'm not thinking about the favor being returned, others noticing my act of kindness or even going to heaven. It just feels good to help people. This is my "payment" and "compensation desire", and I have no desire for it to be "turned off." I don't believe that I'm even remotely unique in feeling this way. I believe that I am in the majority.

Your "payment" is the feeling you get. You were conditioned to enjoy helping others. You are "good" not because you choose to be, or because there is some mystical force making you that way. You do good because you learned that it is preferable to "doing bad".

I'm still not convinced about the whole "inherently good" theory. Go ahead and provide your anecdotal stories of spontaneous "good" people have done, and I can counter with as many (or more) random acts of evil.

From individual behavior (psychological) to group actions (sociological), evil is committed by the person(s) with the faulty conditioning. Conversely, good acts are performed by those that conform with the societal norms. Sure, there's the occasional Ted Bundy sociopath. That's within the realm of statistical error.

Good outnumbering Evil? Visa Versa? The numbers can be increased or decreased by the actions we make individually and as a society.

Originally Posted by Winston

Your "payment" is the feeling you get. You were conditioned to enjoy helping others. You are "good" not because you choose to be, or because there is some mystical force making you that way. You do good because you learned that it is preferable to "doing bad".

I'm still not convinced about the whole "inherently good" theory. Go ahead and provide your anecdotal stories of spontaneous "good" people have done, and I can counter with as many (or more) random acts of evil.

Well, you can look at this from a couple different points of view. Referring to a positive feeling as a payment is a bit misleading, because it implies you have entered into a transaction with someone, when what you're really doing is chasing pleasure or "positive feelings."We are indeed conditioned from an early age to believe that performing within the norms of society is the expectation, and the respect/community/positive reinforcement of our peers all feed into our pleasure.

Let's step away from that for a second.

I think the effects of stress and anxiety are sufficiently documented that we can agree they are harmful to the human condition. As a species, we prefer a state that's stress and anxiety-free. We will seek the safety of shelter, we will stock up on food and other necessary supplies in case of emergency, and we will minimize the number of threats to our well being.

Creating a fair society with rules designed to safeguard the well being of everyone is in the best interests of humans. We are generally "good" by society's standards because that's the only way to remove stress and anxiety related to everything society has to offer. That may be why you see crime or "evil" being perpetrated for the most part by those marginalized by society: they feel they have nothing to lose.

I'd say we're mostly good because being good "pays off." It feeds into the psychological needs we have. Does it mean we're selfish for being good? You could probably argue something in that line, but then I suppose we'd have to determine if being selfish in this case is a negative thing. God helps those whom help themselves.

There have been some very good answers regarding this topic, some of which have actually altered my point of view, somewhat. Many seem to agree that there is a gray area that makes this question difficult to answer. However, I still don't agree that people always help others because of a "payoff." Yes, I feel good about myself when I help someone, but this reward is not what I am seeking when I shovel the neighbor lady's driveway or help someone who's stuck or broke down along side the road. I don't feel that I'm seeking anything. I just care about another person's well-being. If a man fell off a bridge into icy water below, people are going to immediately spring into action. Are these people immediately seeking a payoff? Granted, there could very well be a monster in the crowd that would enjoy just standing there and watching this man freeze or drown, but the majority of people are hard-wired to help this man. Why?