Chracter Before The Plot? - Writers Forum

A Vaulter's Insanity · 04-20-2008, 10:28 PM

Now I'm a relatively new writer, both to these forums and to the whole writing world. I'm only 17 and havn't too much practice. But after seeing so many of my failed stories, and reading the thread Writing about something you know nothing about I finally know why some of my stories just won’t pick up.

When I write a story spur of the moment and create everything on the spot, those are my best stories. But when i sit down and think about the plot and where my story is going before I actually start writing, it’s usually a pretty boring story. And I’ve finally figured out why. In my spur of the moment stories, my characters come out fully formed and rearing to go. But when I plan it all out, I always make the plot before the character instead of based on the characters so my characters end up being Mary Sue's. Just utensils to get the story from one place to another.

The conversation in the thread I was talking about…

Quote:

Truth-Teller: That's why science fiction and fantasy are the worst genre. They do not expound or expand on human qualities but rather on plot.

seigfried007: Umm, being a science-fiction and fantasy writer, I must say that I take offense to your comment, JTT. There's lots of good fiction that's based on characters progressing as people rather than merely being utensils of the plot. It's how I prefer to write and what I prefer to read.

While I completely disagree that science fiction and fantasy are the worst genre, I understand what he means.

So after all this babble, here’s my question. How do you guys make your characters more interesting so that they advance the plot and make it exciting rather than just making them a ‘utensil’ to get the plot moving? How do you get the character too come before the plot when you already have a plot in your head? Cause right now I just have a Mary Sue.

Wallmaker · 04-20-2008, 11:59 PM

Ah, the chicken, the egg. Who really knows? I say they occur best around the same time. You develop some character or event, you think about what you need to make a story or a conflict out of it. Story and Character come bursting out.

So, you have Mary Sue. Mary Sue should have a superficial/physical and emotionally impacting problem that should set her out on her story. Take for example, Mary Sue has trouble in relationships because she doesn't trust men after some guy broke her heart. Physically/superficially we see her resist/denounce relationships, avoid dating whomever and declaring herself an eternal spinster. Emotionally, we see someone who's so hurt that she won't reach out to another human being.

What should happen in this story? Plotwise, something should come and shake Mary Sue up. It has nothing to do with formula or a planned out plot (though I recommend making a plan for your character) it has to do with the character arc you want with Mary Sue. If her problem is learning to love again despite her mistrust, then that will be the end goal.

So... this can also work backwards in regards to plot. The type of plot and events you've plotted out can give you milage for your characters. If, persay, I was working on an Indiana Jones type book and there are pits and tombs, it's probably a good idea to give the character a fear of snakes. Etc etc.

Characters should always motivate the events in the story. If not, you suffer from a passive character. If you have a character with no realistic or identifiable problems who does nothing in the middle of an absurd set of events (which is a lot like life) then there's no story.

This goes back to developing Mary Sue. What does Mary Sue need? What does she want? What personal flaw is she overlooking? Then... have her use these things to actively pursue her goal in the story. Mary thinks money is the answer to all of her problems, Mary tries to rob a bank thinking she'll have money and get away with it.

Truth-Teller · 04-21-2008, 12:16 AM

Conflict, tension, and frission.

Look to the truth. Base your characters on what you've experienced, heard, or seen. Base them on real life.

Watch alot of news. See how the people interact and carry out a conversation, in your day-to-day life. Listen to how road rage ends up becoming a double homocide. Hear how gossips spread from one room to the other, and the reason why.

What you need in dead characters are motivation and soul. Write real emotions. Write as if you're writing in a diary, instead of a piece you're trying to get published. Only then will your characters begin to breathe and come alive.

Truth-Teller · 04-21-2008, 12:23 AM

If you really want to know how to create fabulous characters, read alot of Roald Dahl stories for adults.

Every single story hinges on exceptional characterization, character that moves the plot along, with a gut-twisting, mind-blowing, twilight-zone ending in each and every one. Dahl surpasses King in every area, including plot, theme, and message. While King's horror come from an outside source, Dahl's horror come from the characters.

Raging_Hopeful · 04-21-2008, 12:36 AM

I think Wallmaker and TT both have hit it on the nose.

I'll throw in my two cents for good measure: There are lots of character "templates." The superficial, blonde cheerleader, the middle-aged man at a dead end job, the crime detective who drinks too much.... They are templates for a reason, in that they are pervasive throughout the literary (and real) world. Your characters should never stop at being templates. Though there will no doubt be familiar attributes as you create characters, give them something to stand apart. The circus clown who is terrified of heights. The orthodontist with a bad eye twitch. Whatever it is, make it stick and make it count.

Cheers,
Linz

A Vaulter's Insanity · 04-21-2008, 12:52 AM

Thanks guys. Right now my character is just the typical fantasy hero. I just cant make him come to life for me. He just seems like the typical character template thats been done a billion times. The more and more I think about it, the more I realize how close he is to Luke Skywalker. I just cant quite figure out how to make him unique from every other hero. I have one good idea that keeps coming back to me on how to make him unique, but the idea is form a fanfiction I read a while ago, and the last thing I want to do is use somebody else's template like that.

Quote:

What you need in dead characters are motivation and soul. Write real emotions. Write as if you're writing in a diary, instead of a piece you're trying to get published. Only then will your characters begin to breathe and come alive.

That seems to stand out to me though. The more and more I think about it, the more I realize that my character doesnt really have all that much motivation...

Wow, epiphany! THANK YOU GUYS. Ive finally figure it out what Im going to do with the character. Lets just hope I can make it work.

Raging_Hopeful · 04-21-2008, 01:08 AM

Yay! Glad we could help! Good luck!

Oh, love your 2nd quote BTW.

A Vaulter's Insanity · 04-21-2008, 01:11 AM

Thank you on both accounts. And it seems like a lot of people don't understand my second quote, I was thinking about putting something else but I guess Ill keep it.