1984 - Page 4 - Writers Forum

Hodge · 11-27-2006, 01:10 AM

Eh, 1984 is a dystopian novel about social control, but it's completely different. Whereas Brave New World was kept under control by a massive social engineering effort and lots of easy pleasure, 1984 was about fear, coercion, and lies.

Hodge · 11-27-2006, 03:24 AM

There's no democracy in Brave New World. Nor is there corporatation. The people are given everything they want, based on whether they're alphas, betas, deltas, etc.

Ilan Bouchard · 11-27-2006, 10:21 PM

1984 was quite a great book; I made my sister (twelve years old) read this just a month ago or so. I think she'll appreciate Animal Farm a lot more, although I'm proud that she was able to make out a lot of the 1984's intent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hodge

Brazil does a really good job of combining the concepts of 1984 with those of Brave New World, and adding enough comedy and absurdity to make it an incredibly entertaining movie.

I watched Brazil based on your continuously raving reviews about it, yet I didn't understand it in the slightest.

I think I even PMed you about this, when I saw it, last year. But alas, I didn't make any connection between this and Orwell's works (although I haven't read BNW).

Mike C · 11-28-2006, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnitdown

Guess it depends on how you analyze the book.

Only if you analyse it incorrectly.

Mike C · 11-28-2006, 01:10 AM

Brazil is far closer in intent to Orwell's vision than Huxley's.

Except Gillian took the beaurocracy to the ultimate degree - totalitarianism breeds beaurocrats - and combined Orwell's ideas with the realities of life under an opressive govermnent - as in Communist Russia, just getting basic services to work was often a nightmare, the sheer drudgery of life was actually more oppresive than the government.

Hodge · 11-28-2006, 01:23 AM

The movie is full of the crass superficiality and disregard of the important things in life that Brave New World was full of.

Craigy · 11-28-2006, 03:52 PM

I believe that was on a list my English teacher from last year gave me. I'm at the library right now, I might go look for it.

J.E.L.M. · 11-28-2006, 05:19 PM

I read 1984 a few months ago. My father recomended it to me. I think the book itself was well written and the way it described society made perfect sense.
I've been trying to get around to reading Animal Farm, but I have several other books I have to read first such as Eragon (before the movie comes out) and The Great Hunt by Robert Jorden. Eventually, I will get around to it though...

Hodge · 11-28-2006, 05:21 PM

Yeah, Eragon and Robert Jordan books have a much higher priority than Animal Farm.

Hodge · 12-17-2006, 06:58 PM

Animal Farm is his critique of communism, not democracy.

Mike C · 12-18-2006, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hodge

Animal Farm is his critique of communism, not democracy.

Specifically, Animal Farm is a critique of Stalinism.

And 1984 patterned on BNW? I'm assuming you've not only not read either book, but haven't read Huxley's commentary on 1984 and vice versa. Not only are the two totally different, they address completely different issues also. Burnitdown, that comment is about as crass as comparing Animal Farm with Charlotte's web because they're both set on farms.

Hodge · 12-18-2006, 12:18 PM

I wouldn't say Stalinism. I would say he's critiquing the whole communist system because it inevitably leads to something like Stalinism.

CPiseco · 12-26-2006, 09:05 PM

Ah, 1984...one of my absolute favorites. I did my senior thesis on that book.

"We shall squeeze you empty...and we shall fill you with ourselves."

An excellent literary marvel.

I remember arguing with my professor about whether or not Winston actually died in the end.

Good times.

Mike C · 12-27-2006, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hodge

I would say he's critiquing the whole communist system because it inevitably leads to something like Stalinism.

But you'd be wrong. He was writing specifically about Stalin. Read his biography, related essays etc.

CPiseco · 12-27-2006, 09:36 AM

You can go further than the traditional methods of governing he may have been critiquing in 1984. If you dive deeper, and look at it from a philosophical point of view, I think you open a whole new can entirely.

Nietzsche's Beyond Good and Evil, Prelude to a Philosophy of the Future I believe was a big influence in Orwell's works, especially 1984. You can find the very heart of Nietzche in Big Brother: Big Brother's interest and primary instinct is the will to power. The will to survive is even secondary to Big Brother's desire for power: "self-preservation is only one of the indirect and most frequent results."

Some might argue that the will to survive takes precedent over the will to power, but I cannot agree. The mindless purges put forth by Big Brother; the deteriorating conditions in which Big Brother's people live (even the members of his Inner Party), the constant glowing economic reports with no evidence to back them up...even as Big Brother's "empire" struggles just to eat all around him, as long as it's in his control, "he" has satisfied "his" will to power.

Nietzche stated that all living things are not driven so much to stay alive as they are to possess, control, wield and expand upon power. And in doing so, he who does achieve such a feat, will consume all other wills by all other living things; thus making those living things his own. The cycle of power.

Nobody dies a martyr in 1984. Winston's will to love and be free was not only crushed, but it was completely removed from him.

The Party wins, it's will as strong as ever. Big Brother is love, is freedom. Winston dies at the end...loving Big Brother.

No one dies a martyr.